Bringing back film cameras

MESuper1981 · 11-27-2021, 11:31 AM

I don't think storing the data is the challenge...

LesDMess · 11-27-2021, 11:56 AM

This one is the most "elegant" DIY I have seen on this topic . . .

Youtu.be

Lord Lucan · 11-27-2021, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by MESuper1981

I don't think storing the data is the challenge

It certainly isn't. The real challenge is the OP's Point (3) which is a film insert for a digital camera, although he knows 10 different ways to do it.

Originally posted by LesDMess

This one is the most "elegant" DIY I have seen on this topic

As long as you want a tiny angle of view. Like most digital inserts or conversions of film cameras, it is an interesting project but of little real use.

LesDMess · 11-27-2021, 12:30 PM

Originally posted by Lord Lucan

It certainly isn't. The real challenge is the OP's Point (3) which is a film insert for a digital camera, although he knows 10 different ways to do it.

As long as you want a tiny angle of view. Like most digital inserts or conversions of film cameras, it is an interesting project but of little real use.

By elegant DIY I meant not as Frankensteinian as this other one . . .

Youtu.be

But defnitiely not something I am interested in as my digitization comes via scanning the film as the same roll fits all my cameras just fine . . .

MESuper1981 · 11-27-2021, 12:41 PM

There is a kickstarter project that solves the crop problem by using a mirror, a bit bulky though. I'm Back35. Have a roll already? I'm not jealous. | Indiegogo

Lord Lucan · 11-27-2021, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by MESuper1981

There is a kickstarter project that solves the crop problem

The promotor of I'm Back pops up on this forum from time to time, and the reception of his invention is not 100% enthusiastic. Essentially, with I'm Back, the film camera has a translucent screen in place of the film, and a tiny low-resolution digital camera takes a photo of the rear face of that, via a mirror. The project was one of the examples I had in mind when I said that digital conversions of film cameras were generally little more than passing novelties.

MESuper1981 · 11-27-2021, 01:31 PM

At the end, the question is "Why ?".

Old lenses can easily be used on digital cameras. I don't see any advantage in using an analog body with some sort of adapter, instead of shooting with a digital camera right away. Actually, it just complicates things and leads to many compromises. At the end it, the analog camera body will only be a bulky holder to attach lenses to what actully is a custom digital cam.

**TwoUptons** · 11-27-2021, 01:41 PM

I saw a thing recently where Fuji introduced a digital camera with a built-in printer for their Instax film.

I've seen the Instax printers before, but this was the first time I'd seen the printer completely integrated with the camera.
It basically takes a digital photo then prints it onto the film before feeding it through the rollers to develop it.

So one option for using film would be to replicate that... a high resolution LED array that prints digital files onto 35mm film...
Things like that existed (with lower resolution) back in the 90s for making 35mm slides from Powerpoint slides... but I've not looked into it lately...

Obviously that's not got the awesomeness of shooting directly onto film, but it would have "the look" and avoid most of the hassles of sticking a digital sensor into a film camera.
So that turns the question around a bit... instead of shooting digital on a film camera, you'd be shooting film on a digital... sort of...

-Eric

redrockcoulee · 11-27-2021, 01:41 PM

I shoot film cameras in order to shoot film. I use my digital cameras to shoot digital.

I cannot see how the manufacturing of a decent 135 slr can compete with the current prices of existing ones.

wadge22 · 11-27-2021, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by MESuper1981

...the analog camera body will only be a bulky holder to attach lenses to what actully is a custom digital cam.

In my vision the entirety of the device fits within the closed back of the 35mm film camera. When in use the device would not be visible at all, any more so than the film roll would be. So it would be significantly more svelte than current Pentax FFs.

Since I cannot imagine resolution and dynamic range could be made to rival dedicated digital bodies, it would always be more a gimmick than one of the top options for those looking for top images. But for those of us who shoot mostly for the enjoyment of the activity itself (which for some may not extend to mixing chemicals and feeling around in dark rooms), this concept would offer the unique ergonomics and process that whichever old body you've chosen provides.

**ProfessorBuzz** · 11-27-2021, 05:30 PM

I'd pay top dollar for a "Pentax LX II" that had modern AF, electronic timer, all the exposure modes of my K1, and compatibility with the latest KAF-4 lenses. eg electronic aperture and focus motors.

**ChrisPlatt** · 11-27-2021, 05:58 PM

It's nice to dream. Instead I'm working on building a time machine.
Note to self: When you transport yourself back bring lots of cash.

Chris

filmmaster · 11-27-2021, 08:55 PM

I want one of you to tear down an unwanted canon rebel 35mm camera and a digital one from the garbage bin. See how much internal differences there are.

LesDMess · 11-27-2021, 09:17 PM

Originally posted by filmmaster

I want one of you to tear down an unwanted canon rebel 35mm camera and a digital one from the garbage bin. See how much internal differences there are.

What for? There are quite a few of them posted such as this one of a Canon 30D DSLR . . .

Youtu.be

There are also many film SLR teardowns too.

**AgentL** · 11-27-2021, 11:19 PM

Conversions are never going to work, to really work. Tiny sensors with a huge crop on vintage glass might be a fun diversion, but they aren't useful. The best option would be for someone to dare to make a new film camera. An SLR would be the optimal type to make, because it wouldn't take a lot of r&d to implement the mirror, metering and viewfinder optics along with a shutter off the shelf. Without a fast, complicated processor and an imaging sensor, it wouldn't be that expensive to create.

11-27-2021, 01:11 PM	#21
Lord Lucan Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: South Wales Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,977	Originally posted by MESuper1981 There is a kickstarter project that solves the crop problem The promotor of I'm Back pops up on this forum from time to time, and the reception of his invention is not 100% enthusiastic. Essentially, with I'm Back, the film camera has a translucent screen in place of the film, and a tiny low-resolution digital camera takes a photo of the rear face of that, via a mirror. The project was one of the examples I had in mind when I said that digital conversions of film cameras were generally little more than passing novelties. Last edited by Lord Lucan; 11-27-2021 at 05:01 PM. Reason: Tpyo

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11-27-2021, 11:31 AM	#16
MESuper1981 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 43	I don't think storing the data is the challenge...

11-27-2021, 12:21 PM	#18
Lord Lucan Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: South Wales Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,977	Originally posted by MESuper1981 I don't think storing the data is the challenge It certainly isn't. The real challenge is the OP's Point (3) which is a film insert for a digital camera, although he knows 10 different ways to do it. Originally posted by LesDMess This one is the most "elegant" DIY I have seen on this topic As long as you want a tiny angle of view. Like most digital inserts or conversions of film cameras, it is an interesting project but of little real use.

11-27-2021, 12:41 PM	#20
MESuper1981 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 43	There is a kickstarter project that solves the crop problem by using a mirror, a bit bulky though. I'm Back35. Have a roll already? I'm not jealous. \| Indiegogo

11-27-2021, 01:31 PM	#22
MESuper1981 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 43	At the end, the question is "Why ?". Old lenses can easily be used on digital cameras. I don't see any advantage in using an analog body with some sort of adapter, instead of shooting with a digital camera right away. Actually, it just complicates things and leads to many compromises. At the end it, the analog camera body will only be a bulky holder to attach lenses to what actully is a custom digital cam.

11-27-2021, 01:41 PM	#23
TwoUptons Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,223	I saw a thing recently where Fuji introduced a digital camera with a built-in printer for their Instax film. I've seen the Instax printers before, but this was the first time I'd seen the printer completely integrated with the camera. It basically takes a digital photo then prints it onto the film before feeding it through the rollers to develop it. So one option for using film would be to replicate that... a high resolution LED array that prints digital files onto 35mm film... Things like that existed (with lower resolution) back in the 90s for making 35mm slides from Powerpoint slides... but I've not looked into it lately... Obviously that's not got the awesomeness of shooting directly onto film, but it would have "the look" and avoid most of the hassles of sticking a digital sensor into a film camera. So that turns the question around a bit... instead of shooting digital on a film camera, you'd be shooting film on a digital... sort of... -Eric

11-27-2021, 01:41 PM	#24
redrockcoulee Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Medicine Hat Posts: 2,306	I shoot film cameras in order to shoot film. I use my digital cameras to shoot digital. I cannot see how the manufacturing of a decent 135 slr can compete with the current prices of existing ones.

11-27-2021, 02:21 PM	#25
wadge22 Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2021 Location: NE Ohio Photos: Albums Posts: 897	Originally posted by MESuper1981 ...the analog camera body will only be a bulky holder to attach lenses to what actully is a custom digital cam. In my vision the entirety of the device fits within the closed back of the 35mm film camera. When in use the device would not be visible at all, any more so than the film roll would be. So it would be significantly more svelte than current Pentax FFs. Since I cannot imagine resolution and dynamic range could be made to rival dedicated digital bodies, it would always be more a gimmick than one of the top options for those looking for top images. But for those of us who shoot mostly for the enjoyment of the activity itself (which for some may not extend to mixing chemicals and feeling around in dark rooms), this concept would offer the unique ergonomics and process that whichever old body you've chosen provides.

11-27-2021, 05:30 PM	#26
ProfessorBuzz Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 1,903	I'd pay top dollar for a "Pentax LX II" that had modern AF, electronic timer, all the exposure modes of my K1, and compatibility with the latest KAF-4 lenses. eg electronic aperture and focus motors.

11-27-2021, 05:58 PM	#27
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,696	It's nice to dream. Instead I'm working on building a time machine. Note to self: When you transport yourself back bring lots of cash. Chris

11-27-2021, 08:55 PM	#28
filmmaster Banned Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 141 Original Poster	I want one of you to tear down an unwanted canon rebel 35mm camera and a digital one from the garbage bin. See how much internal differences there are.

11-27-2021, 11:19 PM	#30
AgentL Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,759	Conversions are never going to work, to really work. Tiny sensors with a huge crop on vintage glass might be a fun diversion, but they aren't useful. The best option would be for someone to dare to make a new film camera. An SLR would be the optimal type to make, because it wouldn't take a lot of r&d to implement the mirror, metering and viewfinder optics along with a shutter off the shelf. Without a fast, complicated processor and an imaging sensor, it wouldn't be that expensive to create.