[Jonathan Mac]

I don't know that that's necessarily true.

I frequent film photography groups across a bunch of different platforms (traditional forums like this one and RFF, sites like DPR, hybrid forums like Reddit and social media like FB and IG), and from what I've seen there is a spectrum of film users from the hardcore gear nuts who never share an image, through to the 'art nerds' who barely understand how to load film*.

Point being, there is definitely a group out there who neither understand or care about the gear, and will get whatever is recommended to them.

I am undecided over which is worse - the gearhead who never posts a photo or the gearhead who takes terrible photos...

*As an aside, I came across one of these 'art nerds' at work once. They had a lovely looking OM1n and I asked if I could check it out. Looked through the viewfinder and was surprised to see that the image was perfectly circular and everything was in focus... They had been sold a camera WITHOUT A FOCUSSING SCREEN. Nonetheless they'd been using and enjoying if for 6 months, loved the output and had absolutely no idea anything was remiss...

Wow

[martin42mm]

I don't know that that's necessarily true.

I frequent film photography groups across a bunch of different platforms (traditional forums like this one and RFF, sites like DPR, hybrid forums like Reddit and social media like FB and IG), and from what I've seen there is a spectrum of film users from the hardcore gear nuts who never share an image, through to the 'art nerds' who barely understand how to load film*.

Point being, there is definitely a group out there who neither understand or care about the gear, and will get whatever is recommended to them.

*As an aside, I came across one of these 'art nerds' at work once. They had a lovely looking OM1n and I asked if I could check it out. Looked through the viewfinder and was surprised to see that the image was perfectly circular and everything was in focus... They had been sold a camera WITHOUT A FOCUSSING SCREEN. Nonetheless they'd been using and enjoying if for 6 months, loved the output and had absolutely no idea anything was remiss...

Never encountered that before, although the original Leicaflex might have been designed that way given how the focus system was designed to be bright and usable, but only in the centre.
Having said that, I just purchased a Praktica IV from a flea-market that had a mirror with about 5% silvering left on it, and the 135mm P/S lens fitted had a focus-ring tube that fell off as soon as you tilted the camera away from horizontal, plus the whole lens block was not screwed in either, so had a tendancy to fall forward as well, fortunately stopped by the barrel shape inside! Seems the guy who sold it had been using it until very recently.....

[Autonerd]

Love the K2DMD, but I certainly wouldn't like to rely on the electronics after more than 40 years.And if they go, you are stuck with 1/125.

I'm not totally sold on the mechanical-is-better argument. Having bought several old cameras, my experience is that if the shutter works, it works properly, whereas clockwork shutters are more subject to gooped-up lube and will most likely need a CLA. I've received/bought a few electronic-shutter cameras that were DOA (including an ME Super and a P30t), but so far the ones that worked when I got them seemed to have kept right on working -- the exception being a Nikon FE, and I hear those aren't the most reliable cameras. Among Pentaxes, I have a pair of K2s, an ME Super, and a P30t all working perfectly, as well as a handful of Ricoh/Sears SLRs that are my go-to knockabout cameras.

That said... my first camera, Grandpa's KX, is still going strong and working fine after 45 years with no CLA.

Aaron

[martin42mm]

I'm not totally sold on the mechanical-is-better argument. Having bought several old cameras, my experience is that if the shutter works, it works properly, whereas clockwork shutters are more subject to gooped-up lube and will most likely need a CLA. I've received/bought a few electronic-shutter cameras that were DOA (including an ME Super and a P30t), but so far the ones that worked when I got them seemed to have kept right on working -- the exception being a Nikon FE, and I hear those aren't the most reliable cameras. Among Pentaxes, I have a pair of K2s, an ME Super, and a P30t all working perfectly, as well as a handful of Ricoh/Sears SLRs that are my go-to knockabout cameras.

That said... my first camera, Grandpa's KX, is still going strong and working fine after 45 years with no CLA.

Aaron

The great thing about mechanical cameras is that they CAN be got working again , and no-one takes a camera out for a shoot without testing first, and a lubricant/shutter tension issue is NOT going to suddenly happen, whereas electronic/battery issues can happen suddenly. I make these comments as a camera repairer, and a user of Pentax cameras for more than 50 years, including electronic-controlled ones. So if I wanted to be 100% certain of having a fully-working camera I would take either a 100% mechanical camera body OR a hybrid electronic/mechanical controlled camera such as an LX. Electronic cameras can be reliable, as my DSLRs have shown, but like all items based on electronic components, they can and do age over time before they eventually fail. And when they do, unless they have dicrete components, they are often beyond repair, be it econnomic or otherwise. Mechanical cameras can usually be resurrected even if no parts are available, usually by culling a part from a beyond-repair donor.

[TwoUptons]

I've had a number of cameras and lenses break on me...

Of the several MEs that I've had break (or arrive broken), I think all of them had mechanical failures, not electronic ones.
My H1a locked up once, and whatever happened took out the curtain streamers, so there was always a black bar on every photo after that... (recently fixed)
I had a PC35 literally come apart in my hands, and nearly all of them seem to have a bad flash catch...
I've had film transport and meter issues with MXs.
But I think every camera I've had made after the mid-80s that failed, except the MZ/ZX series, had an electronic failure, though several of those were from impacts or liquid.
Most of those were compacts... and man, I hate the "Err" indicators on the 90s compacts... "I'm broken and I won't tell you why... since even the error codes are obtuse..."
The MZs have all apparently been the mirror gear...

-Eric

[martin42mm]

I've had a number of cameras and lenses break on me...

Of the several MEs that I've had break (or arrive broken), I think all of them had mechanical failures, not electronic ones.
My H1a locked up once, and whatever happened took out the curtain streamers, so there was always a black bar on every photo after that... (recently fixed)
I had a PC35 literally come apart in my hands, and nearly all of them seem to have a bad flash catch...
I've had film transport and meter issues with MXs.
But I think every camera I've had made after the mid-80s that failed, except the MZ/ZX series, had an electronic failure, though several of those were from impacts or liquid.
Most of those were compacts... and man, I hate the "Err" indicators on the 90s compacts... "I'm broken and I won't tell you why... since even the error codes are obtuse..."
The MZs have all apparently been the mirror gear...

-Eric

I have to agree with you re the ME and ME Super, and if fact ALL the M series cameras, except the MX. They suffered a rmechanical problem which afflicts the wind-on hook-up, leaving the shutter uncocked. I've never found a satisfactory way of fixing it, although I did read somewhere recently of claims that a repairer had managed to sort out a fix, and done it to dozens of them. Sadly I can't verify that claim, and I know when I investigated it back in the early 1980s, I could see no way of resolving the issue, which seemed to be caused by simple wear to a fundemental part of one of the the wind-on levers in the base of the camera.

There will always be an issue with at least a small percentage of mechanical cameras having a fault at some time in their lifetime. It's a bit like a car that is never serviced or maintained-there will inevitably be a failure, and the vast majority of cameras will never be serviced until the day they finally cry enough, and fail . Fortunately, which brings me back to my original point, mechanical cameras rarely fail without some warning of an impending issue, so if a camera is working fine before it is taken out for a photographic session, the chances are it will still be working when needed. For example you cannot predict if the glue on the blind tapes is going to give up the ghost after your pre-check, however the chances of both letting go simultaneously is remote , and one will show an issue before they other goes. But almost, and I repeat almost, any mechanical camera can be resurrected if there is a failure, usually these days by using donor parts from a camera that is beyond redemption, and even that is sometimes for an economic reason rather than because it is truly dead.


I don't claim the K1000 is truly bullet-proof, but given the mechanism is very closely based on the preceding Spotmatics, it is going to be a very good bet it will outlast the user. In the 50 + years I have used Spotmatics, as well as collecting them, I have only one 'failure'. That was because a small pellet of metal from the manufacturing process ended up inside the camera body, until it eventually worked its way into a position where it jammed the wind-on. Removing the top, and shaking out the offending pellet solved the problem instantly! Yes, the meters can stop working, but usually because someone has left a battery in that has leaked, corroding the connecting wire(s). I've never encountered a failure of the meter galvo or the meter cells. And if we're being really accurate, yes, the stop-down switch does eventually stop returning automatically, and can only be fixed by stripping the mirror cage out since it it can only be reached from behind the front plate. I don't usually bother and return the switch to its default position manually. The K1000 doesn't have that problem, being K-mount.

[andrewd]

I would say my hobby is halfway between being a gear nerd and enjoying the artistic side of making images. I shoot about 10 rolls a year and out if each roll I usually have a couple of images that I am happy with, and post a few on forums from time to time. I sort of like how it is more challenging to get a great image out of a vintage film camera than it is from a modern digital camera.

My favourite Pentax is the MX. Good to see this is off the hipster radar and still reasonably priced on the used market. The thing that puts me off the K1000 and KM is that the meter is constantly on and draining batteries while the lens cap is off. I never use a lens cap when out shooting. Perhaps this is not an issue in practice but it just seems like a bad idea intuitively. I love the build quality and size of the KX but it is let down by its dim viewfinder.

[martin42mm]

I would say my hobby is halfway between being a gear nerd and enjoying the artistic side of making images. I shoot about 10 rolls a year and out if each roll I usually have a couple of images that I am happy with, and post a few on forums from time to time. I sort of like how it is more challenging to get a great image out of a vintage film camera than it is from a modern digital camera.

My favourite Pentax is the MX. Good to see this is off the hipster radar and still reasonably priced on the used market. The thing that puts me off the K1000 and KM is that the meter is constantly on and draining batteries while the lens cap is off. I never use a lens cap when out shooting. Perhaps this is not an issue in practice but it just seems like a bad idea intuitively. I love the build quality and size of the KX but it is let down by its dim viewfinder.

Cameras only drain battery power to any notable degree in bright conditions. Even without a lens cap, the camera will probably be in a case or gadget bag. So virtually no drain. And the batteries are hardly expensive if you buy in bulk. Personally a lens cap is a must for any lens-and better than a filter-to protect front elements which can, and do get marked as I've seen so often when servicing and cleaning lenses, so should really not be treated just as an afterthought.

The MX certainly has a brighter screen and v/f, and is the more compact camera.Just don't be tempted for whatever reason to touch the blind curtains, because any loss of tension in them will result in one or both blinds suffering from their connecting cords ( not tapes) falling off their pulleys. Then a complete strip-down is needed to get them back on again!

Of the two, the K1000 and the KM are the more robust,but less sophisticated than the MX, especially regarding the v/f brightness, which was my main reaosn for migrating from my Spotmatics to one in the early 1980s. That bright screen is a very compelling reason for buying the MX!

[TwoUptons]

I would say my hobby is halfway between being a gear nerd and enjoying the artistic side of making images. I shoot about 10 rolls a year and out if each roll I usually have a couple of images that I am happy with, and post a few on forums from time to time. I sort of like how it is more challenging to get a great image out of a vintage film camera than it is from a modern digital camera.

My favourite Pentax is the MX. Good to see this is off the hipster radar and still reasonably priced on the used market. The thing that puts me off the K1000 and KM is that the meter is constantly on and draining batteries while the lens cap is off. I never use a lens cap when out shooting. Perhaps this is not an issue in practice but it just seems like a bad idea intuitively. I love the build quality and size of the KX but it is let down by its dim viewfinder.

My K1000 lives on a shelf in the light when I'm not shooting it, so the battery will die since I always forget the eyepiece cap... and often the lens cap...

But I always take the battery out and put it behind the camera on the shelf... I'm more worried about corrosion than I am about killing batteries that I can buy inexpensively from loads of places.

-Eric

[martin42mm]

My K1000 lives on a shelf in the light when I'm not shooting it, so the battery will die since I always forget the eyepiece cap... and often the lens cap...

But I always take the battery out and put it behind the camera on the shelf... I'm more worried about corrosion than I am about killing batteries that I can buy inexpensively from loads of places.

-Eric

Agreed re taking batteries out. Even if they do not leak they do outgas over time, and it is that which causes the battery compartment connecting wires to corrode, necessitating replacement. Unfortunately it can be very time consuming to solder in those replacements since very often the toplate requires lifting to make the upper connection . Wires rarely have sufficient spare length available in the bottom of a camera to enable the corroded section to be cut away and the good wire resoldered ,plus making a satisfactory joint is rarely possible.

As for having cameras on display, I used to have many dozens in various display cabinets and on open shelves, but I still kept lens caps on. No quite as aesthetically pleasing as a 'naked' lens, but front lens elements not only get grimy, the metalliic oxides are deteriorated over time by moisture in the air ( modern lenses sem less susceptible, although that may just be because they are newer), which causes damage to the coating and leaves a mottled effect. A lens cap prevents this to a great extent. Unfortunately this deterioration is rarely reversible , and some makes of lenses are more susceptible than others.

[andrewd]

I was thinking about the battery drain on a typical shooting outing. There would be a 2-3 hour window when the camera would be exposed to enough light to keep the meter turned on and battery draining, compared to just a few minutes of battery drain if you only turn on the meter when actually taking a picture.

Curious to know what the real world battery life is for the K1000 if it is used like this. Obviously batteries are cheap, but its one more thing to check, compared to a design that conserves battery life by only switching on the meter when needed.

[martin42mm]

I was thinking about the battery drain on a typical shooting outing. There would be a 2-3 hour window when the camera would be exposed to enough light to keep the meter turned on and battery draining, compared to just a few minutes of battery drain if you only turn on the meter when actually taking a picture.

Curious to know what the real world battery life is for the K1000 if it is used like this. Obviously batteries are cheap, but its one more thing to check, compared to a design that conserves battery life by only switching on the meter when needed.

Never done a 'real world' check, especially since I always pop my lens cap back on between shooting sessions. Must have been a Vicorian photographer in an earlier life......
However even with a lens cap i doubt the drain would be high enough to flatten a battery assuming it was in good nick at the start of the day, especially since with all-mechanical cameras it does nothing other than power the meter circuit. Be interesting if anyone has done that test-anyone?

[TwoUptons]

I was thinking about the battery drain on a typical shooting outing. There would be a 2-3 hour window when the camera would be exposed to enough light to keep the meter turned on and battery draining, compared to just a few minutes of battery drain if you only turn on the meter when actually taking a picture.

Curious to know what the real world battery life is for the K1000 if it is used like this. Obviously batteries are cheap, but its one more thing to check, compared to a design that conserves battery life by only switching on the meter when needed.

When my K1000 was my only camera, the battery generally lasted months, even when I was shooting a lot... (though a lot in the 1980s with film was different than now, obviously)

Two weeks on a holiday tour with my grandmother? no problem.

If it's around your neck with a lens cap on, the meter is off...

For battery life these days, I would be more worried that one of the cheap batteries I bought in bulk (they go in other things, too) was mostly dead when I put it in...

When I shoot with film cameras with electronic shutters, etc. I always carry a spare battery. With the K1000/MX/KX, I don't, figuring I can keep working without if I need to...

-Eric

[martin42mm]

When my K1000 was my only camera, the battery generally lasted months, even when I was shooting a lot... (though a lot in the 1980s with film was different than now, obviously)

Two weeks on a holiday tour with my grandmother? no problem.

If it's around your neck with a lens cap on, the meter is off...

For battery life these days, I would be more worried that one of the cheap batteries I bought in bulk (they go in other things, too) was mostly dead when I put it in...

When I shoot with film cameras with electronic shutters, etc. I always carry a spare battery. With the K1000/MX/KX, I don't, figuring I can keep working without if I need to...

-Eric

Yes, we're back to the lens cap on/off scenario again. Does anyone have any experience as to how long a battery lasts on a K1000 when used outdoors, but with the lens cap removed for most of the time? I can't say I've ever noticed an issue, but I also carry spare batteries even for meters so it wouldn't matter anyway. I suppose if you were REALLY determined not to use a lens cap, you could reduce the potential battery drain by ( assuming the lens fitted has one) switching the aperture lever to manual and leaving the lens on the smallest aperture. Sadly it was a feature that virtually disappeared after the K-mount came in.

[gofour3]

The KX fixed all the SP/KM/K1000 meter/lens cap issues, while still being fully manual and well built.

That was one of the reasons I bought a KX in 1975 and not the SP or KM (K1000 was not available yet), even though the KX cost more and I had limited money back then. (poor teenager)

Phil.