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02-02-2012, 09:35 PM   #1
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MZ-5n problem - not the usual mirror thing...

...it's actually the other one, a little less common. I have a problem with the film advance mechanism. I bought the camera on a local online bidding website in Holland and shot some 3-4 rolls. On the first couple of rolls the problem appeared on a couple of spots. On the last roll the problem is present at least in two shots out of six (you can see on the photo).



You might think why I opened a thread if I know the problem and if I read all the threads that deal with the "poorly" made MZ series (at least the lower range until mz-5n). I find the camera fantastic, so I'm willing to repair it. I'm planning to give the camera to a local repairman that I have "faith" in (he "saved" the shutter on my PZ-20 and reassembled the aperture leafs on a F50/f1.7 that fell on some tiles), but I have some questions about all that situation.

1. Is this definitely a motor advance problem or it might just need a cleaning/adjustment of some electrical sensor (as mentioned in this thread) etc?? I guess there is a plastic (?) gear somewhere that should be checked when open?

2. I saw in this thread a lot of information about the mirror motor problem and servicing it. I would be very thankful if someone could point out where is the film advance motor (and it's gear) in the camera. And also where is the electrical sensor (see 1.).

3. In the mentioned thread, I saw two online place where I could pare a spare motor and making a new brass gear. Witch option would be the best if the actual gear is the problem?

4. The camera is "made in Japan", SN: 7712585. I read in another thread that some more recent cameras where made without a plastic mirror gear. I don't have that problem, but I'm thinking if I would have such a problem in the near future (beside the current one).

5. If I don't succeed with fixing the camera, does the MZ-6 or MZ-3 has a slightly better construction ? Those would be some alternatives, as the MZ-S is currently out of my reach. Btw, does all the MZ/ZX series cameras has interchangeable parts of the advance motor. Witch camera from that series is the most recent so I could track it down and exchange parts? Maybe I'll find a model with a defective mirror motor.

I maybe forgot to ask something, but anyway I would be very thankful with any answer/suggestion/explanation etc. I searched all over the forum and didn't find some definitive answer on those questionings. I know I can buy another MZ for not much money (but not so easily the better models locally, I'm not from Holland), but I think this camera can be repaired for a reasonable amount of money. As I said the camera is fantastic, ideal to pair with my ME Super.


Last edited by esdy_11192; 02-02-2012 at 09:42 PM.
02-02-2012, 11:28 PM - 1 Like   #2
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The circled part may be dirty. Just clean it with alcohol will do. As to how to get to that part, I will leave that to others because my memory is very remote.

02-03-2012, 05:36 AM   #3
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Thanks for you quick reply wlachan, I'm hopping it's easily reachable trough the bottom plate. I would be very thankful if somebody could answer the other questions. :|
02-04-2012, 05:45 PM - 1 Like   #4
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>>if someone could point out where is the film advance motor (and it's gear) in the camera.>>

When you open the back door, you'll see the film take-up spool on the right-hand side. The motor is inside the spool. All the gears for advance and rewind of film are located at the bottom of the camera. Remove the bottom cover (remember the screw on the left side of battery door is shorter). Follow "the mirror motor" thread to remove the bottom metal plate and front covers. (Use a marking pen to mark the holes on the metal plate before removing the screws, the 2 screws near the lens mount are different.). In case you need to replace some of the film transport gears, I'll send them to you for free. Your problem may be due to the batteries are getting low.


Last edited by violini; 02-04-2012 at 06:05 PM.
02-06-2012, 08:19 AM   #5
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Thanks Violini for that detailed explanation! I'll try to check the problem myself. Actually, I'll clean the electrical contacts and check the state of the gear in the film transport mechanism. If all of that looks OK I'll put a fresh film in the camera to test it and I'll let you know of the results. If some part of the transport mechanism looks bad, I'll tell you witch part it is (thanks for offering the part!!).

As concerning the batteries, I think my father checked them with a multimeter. I shoot only 4 films, a couple of frames with the pop-up flash. I guess they are still OK. I will try to find a battery checker or a multimeter (my father is abroad) to eliminate that potential issue.
02-15-2012, 02:45 PM   #6
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Hi everybody, I followed wlachan's and violini's instructions for reaching the (potentially) problematic parts. Last night I needed nearly two hours, because I was trying to be careful and don't brake something as it's only plastic, plastic and plastic inside. (I didn't broke anything, but nearly lost some pieces). Sorry for the poor picture quality. My P.S. camera is weak at high ISO and forgot to turn it off

So, I removed the front plates and the bottom metal cover. And I got to this:


(click for bigger)
The gears from the film advance motor. Everything seemed OK. I continued the disassembling.

I removed 4 separate gears and the odd one (it can swing a little bit left and right) with its parts (the plastic screwed part and the little gear beside). That "odd" gear can swing a little bit left and right (it's between the black one in the middle and the white one on the right and I didn't took a photo of it disassembled).

The most tricky part was to reach the part that wlachan marked on the photo. there's a tiny little screw on this part (see photo below) and I was afraid not to brake the bigger plastic part.


I almost lost the small parts when they fell on the floor. They slipped when I managed to safely unscrew the screw.

After that, I cleaned the sensor and I cleaned the gear with the metal parts on it (they touch the sensor). I used common alcohol. All the gears, so far, seemed without a damage.


I put back those parts back.


And I started to put back all the other gears. I used a blower (for camera) to blow any dust and checked if there was any damage on them. Every one of them looked OK.


And the photo with everything put back.




I have yet to put an empty film and to test it. I put in it an old test film to see if the camera works again. Everything seemed OK. I shot it through the end of the film, it re-winded it nicely. Every function on the camera apparently worked etc.

If the problem is not solved, I guess that the only other possibility would be the advance motor itself. I guess it could be also changed. I'm not sure how I could be certain if the advance motor is the problem (of course if this doesn't solve the problem).

I would be glad if wlachan and violini (or anybody that is interested in this) gives an input/opinion/comment on this reply.

cheers
02-18-2012, 12:11 PM   #7
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Can anybody say something about the cleaning ?? Did I do it the right way ?

Btw, I will put a test roll in it and write the result here.
I hope it's not the film advance motor that is problematic. :|
02-18-2012, 05:31 PM   #8
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I would load a roll of 24 and test it. The film is advanced by counting the number of holes along the edge of the film, each frame is 8 holes in width. Check the teeth on the lower part of the winding spool and the gear on the left side. Also clean the battery door (+) to the edge contact. I only use Duracell and Energizer brands, Those 1-dollar batteries do not work on my camera, they are a bit too long making it difficult to close the battery door and die really fast. I ran through over 200 rolls of films in one of my MZ-6 and have not encountered any problem yet.


Last edited by violini; 02-18-2012 at 05:54 PM.
02-21-2012, 09:05 AM   #9
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Thanks Violini for the reply. I checked the teeth on the lower part of the winding spool and the gear on the left side, everything seems ok. I also cleaned the battery door. I will put a cheap film in it and will post the results. Maybe the result will be valuable to other members of the forum.
03-09-2012, 08:11 AM   #10
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UPDATE!!!

I'm very happy to announce that the problem with the overlapping frames seems gone! I just developed the 24 frame roll the other day. Not a single close or even overlapping frame. When the film finished the counter was at 26, immediately I had a good feeling about that.



I would like to thank violini and wlachan! You have at least a beer from me, if we ever meet. Really nice of you for helping. I should test another roll very soon and I will update this thread after that. I hope this will help somebody else with the problem.




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