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10-01-2012, 04:49 PM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
you don't have to look very far in the listings to find evidence of flipping
Agreed, and I don't have a problem with that (although I also agree that listings with lots of items are a bit of a pain), so long as sellers aren't over-rating condition. Caveat emptor certainly applies in the Marketplace; personally I'm unlikely to buy from a seller with no feedback and a low post count, and as it happens pretty much all the purchases I've made here have been from listings of one or a few items. I like buying from someone who's actually been using the gear. But that's the beauty of the Marketplace; even if you're new to the forum it's easy to review a seller's general posting history to get a broader background than just seller feedback.

10-01-2012, 05:28 PM   #47
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I'm pretty new here, but I buy and sell frequently on another non-photography forum.. (parallel obsessions being what they are). This kind of thing; flipping gear in the B/S/T section or outright scamming has become rampant on these other sites.. it has now made me wary of ever buying or selling via forums.
10-01-2012, 05:37 PM   #48
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As I recall in the early 2000's I was a complete noob buying this stuff on ebay until I
1. made some mistakes
2. Found sellers I trusted
3. researched Pentax on the internet
4. made more some mistakes
5. learned how to bid
6. learned to allow someone else pay more than I was willing to pay

I've owned just about every famous Pentax lens and camera there is - and sold most of them at a small loss. Almost as if I rented them. Since I joined here I haven't really done much on ebay.

Everyone is a noob at first, and no, it isn't safe for a noob anywhere else, either. However - in general - sellers here are fairer and nicer than the List and the Auction site.
10-01-2012, 05:38 PM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by poppaneedsanap Quote
I'm pretty new here, but I buy and sell frequently on another non-photography forum.. (parallel obsessions being what they are). This kind of thing; flipping gear in the B/S/T section or outright scamming has become rampant on these other sites.. it has now made me wary of ever buying or selling via forums.
I don't understand this equivalence of "flipping" with scamming. Nothing wrong with flipping as long as you describe condition accurately. I buy stuff a lot for the sole purpose of selling it again (i.e. flipping), but I also often spend paragraphs describing any subtle flaws or issues that might arise, even beyond condition problems or defects, but just peculiarities about the item that might not be generally known.

10-01-2012, 05:40 PM   #50
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Welcome Poppaneedsanap -- I hope you'll find, as many do, that this forum is a nice refuge from the typical web forum snarkfest. (Just stay out of News and Rumors and the Political/Religious sections! ) The word "community" is overused in web circles but I think it really does apply here. And this is reflected in the Marketplace. Again, not perfect, caveat emptor, but used carefully it is a great resource.
10-01-2012, 05:42 PM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by vonBaloney Quote
Originally posted by monochrome Quote One buyer thought I took too long to actually package and ship a lens (4 business days). That is too long -- get it out there next day. Once you have the money, you're on the clock.
Yep. I wrote it is fair here. I thought Neutral was, in fact, generous.
10-01-2012, 07:11 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by vonBaloney Quote
I don't understand this equivalence of "flipping" with scamming. Nothing wrong with flipping as long as you describe condition accurately. I buy stuff a lot for the sole purpose of selling it again (i.e. flipping), but I also often spend paragraphs describing any subtle flaws or issues that might arise, even beyond condition problems or defects, but just peculiarities about the item that might not be generally known.
If the majority of flip dealers in the marketplace practiced the steps you described above, then I think I'd be happy buying from them. Sadly, this is not the case. Most of these posts are quickly written, poorly illustrated and often edited and edited and re-edited some more as gear comes and goes. It makes me feel like the seller could be peddling old car parts as quickly as used Pentax gear. One of the truly great things about buying from the PF marketplace is that you are probably buying gear from someone who is enthusiastic about the hobby/profession ... and Pentax. A flip dealer wants to turn a buck and that's all. It just puts a little more "beware" in buyer beware.
10-01-2012, 07:24 PM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by vonBaloney Quote
I don't understand this equivalence of "flipping" with scamming. Nothing wrong with flipping as long as you describe condition accurately. I buy stuff a lot for the sole purpose of selling it again (i.e. flipping), but I also often spend paragraphs describing any subtle flaws or issues that might arise, even beyond condition problems or defects, but just peculiarities about the item that might not be generally known.
I didn't equate flipping with scamming. I was saying that the increase of both padded flipping and scamming on other forums has left me with cold feet somewhat.

I might add that that hasn't stopped me from pouring over the market section here.


10-01-2012, 07:27 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by germar Quote
If the majority of flip dealers in the marketplace practiced the steps you described above, then I think I'd be happy buying from them. Sadly, this is not the case. Most of these posts are quickly written, poorly illustrated and often edited and edited and re-edited some more as gear comes and goes. It makes me feel like the seller could be peddling old car parts as quickly as used Pentax gear. One of the truly great things about buying from the PF marketplace is that you are probably buying gear from someone who is enthusiastic about the hobby/profession ... and Pentax. A flip dealer wants to turn a buck and that's all. It just puts a little more "beware" in buyer beware.
I agree, but I just don't think it has to do with "flipping" per se -- it has to do with quickly written, poorly illustrated, and repeatedly edited posts by lazy people. I see lots of poor ads from other people selling single items as well.
10-01-2012, 07:28 PM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by baro-nite Quote
Welcome Poppaneedsanap -- I hope you'll find, as many do, that this forum is a nice refuge from the typical web forum snarkfest. (Just stay out of News and Rumors and the Political/Religious sections! ) The word "community" is overused in web circles but I think it really does apply here. And this is reflected in the Marketplace. Again, not perfect, caveat emptor, but used carefully it is a great resource.
thanks!! there seems to be a lot of learned folks around here and it does indeed seem to be quite well behaved..
10-01-2012, 08:33 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by vonBaloney Quote
I agree, but I just don't think it has to do with "flipping" per se -- it has to do with quickly written, poorly illustrated, and repeatedly edited posts by lazy people. I see lots of poor ads from other people selling single items as well.
A friend of mine buys from auctions (real ones with people standing in a room) and sells on ebay, nearly always for a profit. He manages the latter because he writes very detailed, informative and accurate listings. Almost every one is a mini-essay on the item for sale. As a result, he gets excellent prices for his sales. The quickly written "I know nothing about cameras" type listings do not do quite so well. Ironic, isn't it?

K.
10-01-2012, 08:36 PM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by baro-nite Quote
Anyway, sorry for taking this thread off-topic from the original posts with discussion about Marketplace rules. Moot point, because Adam has repeatedly said that he is not interested in going beyond the current Marketplace guidelines, so I'll simply agree to disagree with Blue on the question of assumptions.

. . .
Change made to the market place rules.

QuoteQuote:
An asking price or price range must be posted (you may ask for a best offer in addition to your stated price, however) You may not solicit payment to be made via PayPal as a gift. We strongly discourage buyers from accepting offers that request gift payments.
Stay tuned. Adam will be sending this out to everyone.

Last edited by Blue; 10-02-2012 at 05:35 AM.
10-02-2012, 01:59 PM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Change made to the market place rules.

QuoteQuote:
An asking price or price range must be posted (you may ask for a best offer in addition to your stated price, however) You may not solicit payment to be made via PayPal as a gift. We strongly discourage buyers from accepting offers that request gift payments.
Stay tuned. Adam will be sending this out to everyone.
Any chance he might also include something about the "net to me" situation. My last transaction was based on that agreement and while I trust the seller, I am still not sure just how much I actually paid for each aspect of the sale (price + currency exchange rate + shipping + PayPal), though to be honest, the total was still quite agreeable and fair.


Steve
10-02-2012, 04:25 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Any chance he might also include something about the "net to me" situation. My last transaction was based on that agreement and while I trust the seller, I am still not sure just how much I actually paid for each aspect of the sale (price + currency exchange rate + shipping + PayPal), though to be honest, the total was still quite agreeable and fair.


Steve
Personally, I think that comes down to the seller needing to figure out what they need to sell it for and charge for shipping. However, taking the potential gifting option out should clear that up for the most part.
10-03-2012, 04:28 PM   #60
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Here is the announcement.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/forum-suggestions-news-help/201001-news-n...-payments.html
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