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01-26-2014, 11:20 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bootleg Quote
This is exactly what I do. Maybe I have a dud but I've tried loading it every which way and the film pops out of the take up spool, no matter what I do, if I stroke the film advance too quickly.
Two questions:
  • What film? (some film bases are much thinner than traditional materials)
  • Bulk loaded? (film leader too short)

Most commercially available films have a long enough leader that it will wrap at least one full turn around the take-up spool before the sprocket cogs are engaged (top and bottom). The "magic fingers" grab and tighten against the leader due to the reverse camber of the film on the take-up spool. The bend is so abrupt that the film usually has a prominent reverse crease when rewound after exposure.

I sometimes shoot with Rollei Retro 80s which has a rather thin (100 μm) polyester base. It is fairly flexible stuff compared to traditional acetate and while I have never had an issue, I can imagine that it might cause problems with some cameras.

As for short leaders...that should be pretty obvious.

Beyond these two thoughts, I don't know what to say except to maybe be gentle with winding on until the sprockets are engaged and the film is tensioned across the frame gate.


Steve

P.S. There is also the outside chance that your film transport is out of adjustment such that the take-up spool is rotating at the wrong speed.


Last edited by stevebrot; 01-26-2014 at 11:28 PM.
01-27-2014, 05:32 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
No, he isn't kidding. The M8 is the same too.

Here I am waiting for a Digital IKON from Zeiss or a HEXAR RF Digital - a Hexar RF digital would be awesome. It would give Leica a swift kick in the daddy bags, just like the original Hexar RF did in the days of film.
Zeiss claimed they will not make an Ikon digital. That's a shame, because I have their Ikon ZM and it is great film camera. The view/rangefinder is better than any of my Leicas. Of course, Cosina made the Ikon ZM for Zeiss...
01-27-2014, 05:49 AM   #33
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One more thought: some have had difficulty loading because they didn't realize which direction the take-up spool turns. They would fit in the end of the leader and move the spool by finger pressure the wrong way and close the back without advancing a frame. Then the first wind of the film reverses the movement of the spool and the end will pop out almost every time. (Saw this while working in a camera store in the '60s.)
The Canon QL actually did turn the opposite way from most cameras, which was also confusing.
After threading film, I typically use a finger holding the perforations on the prongs of the drive roller while I wind the first frame, then close the back.
01-27-2014, 07:40 AM   #34
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I always make sure the film cassette is properly laid down in the chamber, not pointing up slightly. That's probably overkill but I've never had film 'jump the rails' in a Magic Fingers camera. I suppose I'm willing to let the one or two extra exposures go.

01-27-2014, 09:48 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Two questions:
  • What film? (some film bases are much thinner than traditional materials)
  • Bulk loaded? (film leader too short)

Most commercially available films have a long enough leader that it will wrap at least one full turn around the take-up spool before the sprocket cogs are engaged (top and bottom). The "magic fingers" grab and tighten against the leader due to the reverse camber of the film on the take-up spool. The bend is so abrupt that the film usually has a prominent reverse crease when rewound after exposure.

I sometimes shoot with Rollei Retro 80s which has a rather thin (100 μm) polyester base. It is fairly flexible stuff compared to traditional acetate and while I have never had an issue, I can imagine that it might cause problems with some cameras.

As for short leaders...that should be pretty obvious.

Beyond these two thoughts, I don't know what to say except to maybe be gentle with winding on until the sprockets are engaged and the film is tensioned across the frame gate.


Steve

P.S. There is also the outside chance that your film transport is out of adjustment such that the take-up spool is rotating at the wrong speed.
Thanks for the responses. I'm usually using kodak tri-x, not bulk loaded. I'm starting to think I'm doing something stupid without realizing it. One thought I had this morning that hadn't occurred to me before is I might not be waiting long enough after taking it out of the freezer, or maybe because it's below zero here in wisconsin right now. I can't remember every instance this has happened so it's hard to say. I had the problem with velvia a few times, but not lately.
It might be cold film, less willing to bend?
Thanks for your interest. I've reached a place where I'm no longer certain it's the camera's fault. I usually blame the camera, then the meter, then the film, and finally realize I'm doing something incredibly thoughtless.
01-27-2014, 01:28 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bootleg Quote
finally realize I'm doing something incredibly thoughtless.
Don't we all


Steve
01-27-2014, 01:32 PM   #37
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I kind of like those magic fingers to be honest... never had any issues with them.
But in the same time I never used a changing bag for a 35mm camera either...
03-10-2014, 07:54 PM   #38
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The MX was my first SLR and it also had the "magic fingers", I never had any problems with that at all. I learned early to check the rewind to be certain it had caught and was spooling.
The P30t was my next SLR and the take up spooling was different, but I got used to it just fine as well. Both systems seemed to work well, if started properly.
Someone mentioned that the takeup spool may not be synchronized to the transport cogs. I would CHECK that function!
Grab a roll and waste it by winding it on all the way and watching the cogs and takeup during your "fast" wind. I would do that several times with that same wasted roll to see if anything can be seen that strikes as being weird there.

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