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10-18-2014, 07:29 AM   #1
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Z-1 frame spacing query

Hi All. Hope you can advise a newbie on here.
I have just recently got a Z-1 having previously owned a P30 and also an MZ-7
The Z-1 appeared to be ok, but I've just run a film through it and noticed that there is a frame overlap (in the order of about 10-15% of the frame) affecting five frames from about # 28 through # 33 but then it "clears" for the last few frames (I got 38 from this roll). Exposure etc was spot-on and otherwise, the results were impressive! (btw these were single shots - not using the motor drive)
Bit concerned that it might get worse or be terminal Any ideas/ remedies?
Thanks in advance

10-18-2014, 10:44 PM   #2
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I would email Eric, he will know and should be able to fix the issue.

Here is Eric's web site:

Pentax Camera Service

Phil.
10-19-2014, 01:43 AM - 1 Like   #3
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During the "brass & glass" camera era, all film tranport mechanisms were made with brass and steel gears. When AF bodies started to show, also built in winders/motor drives started replacing the manual "single crank" thumb lever. Film transport mechanisms became simpler by the reduction of parts needed to produce certain movement inside camera. Plastic gears became more commonnand the use of "belts" also helped reduce number of parts, production cost and also provided quieter and faster mechanisms.

I cannot say for sure if the Z1 (PZ1) 's mechanism has belts or how many plastic gears there are, but the only reason for the gearing to miss the standarized frame size, is that there is "something slipping" that may need changing, cleaning or adjusting.

The Z1 is around 15 years old now, and even if it spent the last 10 yrs inside a drawer, I would expect some mechanical or electronics issue by now.

I would suggest having the camera fully checked before taking more pictures. Perhaps it only needs a good cleaning and adjusments, while experiencing more "slippage" episodes could lead towards the need for replacement parts difficult to find.

Let us know your findings,
10-20-2014, 04:51 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by gofour3 Quote
I would email Eric, he will know and should be able to fix the issue.

Here is Eric's web site:

Pentax Camera Service

Phil.
Hi Phil. Appreciate your quick reply! I'm in London UK, so it would probably not be cost-effective for me to send it to Eric in USA & the postage back to me.
I know a reliable repair shop so maybe it's time to send it for servicing! Thanks, John

10-20-2014, 05:09 AM   #5
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Robert. Many thanks for taking the trouble to help. Yes, it's easy to forget how old cameras can be and you tend to expect them to just keep going! (I just saw an article in a photo mag over here in UK which was previewing an up-coming feature on a Pentax K10D and it was titled: "Blast from the past" !! what? A K10d is a new camera... isn't it?) . I remember the old Pentacon 120 SLR's had chronic frame-spacing issues even from new! But never had anything similar in any camera I've owned - hence my surprise when the D&P clerk gave me the contact sheet and asked if I was aware of the problem? No, I agree with your suggestion - I was hoping to use it for the odd paid/pro job (I've got an excellent Tamron lens on it), but I'll get a quote on overhaul like you said and take it from there.. Thanks, John
10-20-2014, 10:18 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by JPMC Quote
,,, an up-coming feature on a Pentax K10D and it was titled: "Blast from the past" ... !! what? A K10d is a new camera... isn't it?
Made me smile too. Shame it was full of incorrect information citing the wrong resolution and the wrong type of sensor...

My K10D got me back into photography seriously, even if I now shoot more film than digital.

K.
10-22-2014, 04:43 PM   #7
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If you're in London you could try Pentax Camera Repair Specialists - Harrow Technical. In the old days, cameras had a cog in the film gate that counted the number of sprockets to advance a frame. When cameras started shooting more frames per second, this became a hindrance and they started to use an IR sensor to count the sprocket holes on the film instead. The Z-1 shoots at up to 3fps, it may use the IR method.

I bought a used Z-1p many many years ago which also suffered from overlapping frames - I returned the camera as this was an option for me at that time.

John.
10-22-2014, 10:36 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnha Quote
In the old days, cameras had a cog in the film gate that counted the number of sprockets to advance a frame.
Ha! Ha! In the old days, the sprocket (cogs) drove the film. Overlapping frames were the result in a failure of an internal clutch mechanism or poor adjustment.


Steve

10-23-2014, 03:25 AM   #9
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Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by johnha Quote
If you're in London you could try Pentax Camera Repair Specialists - Harrow Technical. In the old days, cameras had a cog in the film gate that counted the number of sprockets to advance a frame. When cameras started shooting more frames per second, this became a hindrance and they started to use an IR sensor to count the sprocket holes on the film instead. The Z-1 shoots at up to 3fps, it may use the IR method.

I bought a used Z-1p many many years ago which also suffered from overlapping frames - I returned the camera as this was an option for me at that time.

John.
Hey John! This could be good... only a few miles from me. (Didn't Pentax have a base in the Harrow area sometime back?) I'll check that idea out.
Don't get me started on sensors, though... I scrapped my last car due to sensors problems! every few months some damn sensor or other would play up or fail
Thanks for the tip! John.
10-23-2014, 11:41 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnha Quote
If you're in London you could try Pentax Camera Repair Specialists - Harrow Technical. In the old days, cameras had a cog in the film gate that counted the number of sprockets to advance a frame. When cameras started shooting more frames per second, this became a hindrance and they started to use an IR sensor to count the sprocket holes on the film instead. The Z-1 shoots at up to 3fps, it may use the IR method.

I bought a used Z-1p many many years ago which also suffered from overlapping frames - I returned the camera as this was an option for me at that time.

John.
UPDATE Hey everyone who replied to me about the Z-1 frame space problem. I really appreciate it!
bad news, I'm afraid... I contacted "Harrow technical" (as per reply by Johnha) and also one other repair guy I had used before, but they both declined due to non-availability of parts. Lo-and-behold! another "scrapper" due to sensor failure! Shame, nice camera otherwise.
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