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07-01-2015, 05:08 AM - 1 Like   #16
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J.C. Whitney sells a stick-on plastic chrome "Special Edition" badge.
I put one on my old jalopy but it fell off...

Chris

07-01-2015, 07:07 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I suppose so:
  • Remove wind and rewind lever
  • Remove top plate
  • Unsolder hot shoe wires
  • Remove retainer for pentaprism and prism itself
  • Replace focus screen
  • Check/adjust meter calibration
  • Confirm focus calibration of replacement screen
  • Solder hot shoe wires onto replacement "SE" top plate
  • Reassemble all components with replacement "SE" top plate taking care that the optical path is fully dust free
  • Remove existing factory leatherette
  • Apply replacement leatherette
  • Repackage in special "SE" packaging
Piece of cake, right? I would provide a time estimate of about 45-60 minutes for the screen swap and 30 minutes for the reskin and repackaging. I would add another 15 minutes to swap in the 20-3200 ISO dial and circuitry.* What kind of price markup was assigned to the special edition?


Steve

* The 20-3200 ISO puzzles me as well. The meter circuit on the early K1000s is supposed to have retained the balanced bridge from the SPII (ASA 20-3200) before switching to a galvanometer circuit (different ASA range?) for the later models. It may be that SE cameras represent an attempt to monetize residual stock of the early body type.

(...has done all of the above on cameras similar in complexity to the K1000...)
Yes I agree if you had to change the meter it would be a harder modification.

I also checked my three K1000 manuals, one from the K Series, M Series & A Series area and all three have the ASA range as 20-3200. (The KM is also the same)

So the K1000 is more based on the KM than SP and if the K1000SE modification was just the screen & leatherette then that would be no big deal. Honeywell did way more on some Spotmatics sold in the USA, as well as custom mods.

So the plot thickens.......

Phil.
07-01-2015, 09:19 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tool_Horder Quote
There is no plot to thicken, no conspiracy theory and no distributor modifying Pentax cameras. If it was Honeywell that did the modification why were the same cameras available internationally?
Yes all the Pentax K1000's have the same sensitivity range and yes the only difference is the focusing screen, covering and 2 year warranty. They were not modified by a distributor and were an actual Pentax product assembled on their Hong Kong assembly line. Why would a distributor go to all the trouble of disassembling a camera to change the focus screen? You talk of using left over parts - where do you think 70% on the internals of a KM, KX and K1000 come from. They are exactly the same parts as used in the Spotmatics. Even the K1000 light meter is only a very slightly modified Spotmatic meter. It's a simple question of economics of manufacturing. They had a mechanism that they had ironed all the bugs out of and had stood the test of time as well as having all the tooling set up. If you think about it it is quite obvious why Pentax did it the way they did. By using the sticker none of their manufacturing process had to change, use a standard top plate pressing. The K1000 is just a stripped down version of a KM and KX (different in prism area but main mechanism the same) which was produced for a budget. If a manufacturer was manufacturing a product based on budget would they introduce another change in the production process and make a special part? Even a minor variation on the standard production run that only added a few minutes to the production process per item adds up to quite a large expense when taken over thousands of bodies. Where do you think the bump on top of the early K1000 bodies come from? - it is a small brass cover soldered on to cover the hole in the top plate where the light meter switch protrudes on the KX and the same press was used for all 3 cameras. After the KX was discontinued is when the K1000 bodies lost the bump on top as no doubt Pentax changed the dies to save a little more time in the production process of the remaining bodies as the hole was no longer needed. You will also notice that the late variants of KM's also lost their little bump. This is why K1000SE serial numbers work in batches within the standard serial number range of K1000's rather than having their own range of numbers. If you look at all of Pentax's manufacturing from the pre-spotmatic days it is exactly the same. Each new model is identical to the last variation of the previous model as far as the major components go with extra new features added or changed. All through the years the main changes in the Pentax's camera's design were relating primarily to aperture mechanism and metering.
A couple extra points:

- Honeywell stopped being the Pentax US distributor just after the K Series came out so it would then be Pentax USA that did the mods.

- I have been using and collecting Pentax gear, brochures, manuals & price lists for the last 40 years and a K1000SE is never listed. (I did see a K1000SE ad printed by Pentax USA, but not a worldwide brochure) I'm also quite ware of the differences between the K Series camera models as I own all of them. I just find it very strange you can't see a K1000SE listed anywhere "official".

The whole SE thing is too mickey mouse to come from Japan and reeks of a local modification. There is nothing extra to assembly in HK as they were already making a regular K1000.

Any distributor could have a batch of K1000's in a s/n range, add a screen then engrave a SE on it and sell it as an advanced model with an extra year warranty. Recovering the leatherette is also no big deal.

Anyways that's my take on the K1000SE, if you have proof that a SE was listed in a Pentax Japan produced brochure then I will change my opinion at that time.

Phil.

Last edited by gofour3; 07-01-2015 at 09:28 AM.
07-01-2015, 10:06 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tool_Horder Quote
They are exactly the same parts as used in the Spotmatics. Even the K1000 light meter is only a very slightly modified Spotmatic meter.
Similar CdS cell, but only the early versions had the Spotmatic balanced bridge circuit.


Steve

07-01-2015, 10:07 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by gofour3 Quote
Any distributor could have a batch of K1000's in a s/n range, add a screen then engrave a SE on it and sell it as an advanced model with an extra year warranty. Recovering the leatherette is also no big deal.
What was the mark-up on the SE cameras?


Steve
07-01-2015, 10:42 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
What was the mark-up on the SE cameras?
That's the problem I can't find the K1000SE in any price list.

I'll keep on checking, maybe something will show up.

Phil.
07-01-2015, 11:41 AM   #22
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I have a brown Pentax ME SE and a black ME Super SE. Are there any other models besides the K1000, ME, and ME Super that have turned up as SE models?
07-01-2015, 12:40 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
What was the mark-up on the SE cameras?
They were always a few dollars more than the standard models in the magazine camera store ads.
Similar to the price difference between chrome and "professional black finish" bodies.


QuoteOriginally posted by AquaDome Quote
I have a brown Pentax ME SE and a black ME Super SE. Are there any other models besides the K1000, ME, and ME Super that have turned up as SE models?
K1000 SE, ME SE and ME Super SE are all I remember ever seeing.
None are rare, but the K1000 SE seems to be the most common.


Chris

07-01-2015, 01:55 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChrisPlatt Quote
K1000 SE, ME SE and ME Super SE are all I remember ever seeing.
None are rare, but the K1000 SE seems to be the most common.
I was hoping for a KX SE or K2 SE
07-01-2015, 04:47 PM   #25
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There certainly are a lot of variances over the years. My made in Hong Kong K1000 has a focusing screen without the black circle, just a solid circular microprism in the center of the screen, and an ISO range beginning at 20.

The two K1000 SEs (both engraved) I've owned each have different focusing screens. The first with the standard black leatherette had the traditional SE screen, but the one with a brown leatherette has a split prism with microprism collar plus larger microprism ring around collar. I haven't seen this before in other K1000 cameras.
07-01-2015, 06:17 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tool_Horder Quote
Early Spotmatics had the balanced bridge circuit which was changed to a circuit very similar to the K1000 when the Spotmatics introduced open aperture metering. All K1000's have the same light meter circuit from the start to finish of production.
Well, I guess the service manual has it wrong, though it had detailed instructions on how to adjust the circuits including aperture resistor for both types.


Steve
07-03-2015, 10:51 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Well, I guess the service manual has it wrong, though it had detailed instructions on how to adjust the circuits including aperture resistor for both types.


Steve
I actually have that Service Manual on PDF if its pertinent to post somewhere ?
It does describe two distinct types of metering circuits. They are NOT all the same through the various K1000 models. A standard bridge circuit AND a similar circuit using various resistors.
And for what it is worth .....when I bought my Diamond Rubber gripped K1000SE camera in high school in about 1981 or 1982 it was sold to me as a discontinued model (New old stock) and I paid $179 with a 50mm f2 lens if I remember correctly. The other students actually paid a bit more for the regular K1000's they bought through the school.....Mine was cheaper ! It was new unused in a Pentax box that said K1000 SE right on it.
I never could find out any other info as it was not advertised anywhere. Wasn't until recently that I am seeing others so it was not some enigma standing alone all by its self....it was and is a genuine model. With the two now that I have owned....and four more internet pictures of the exact same camera model.....IT DOES EXIST !

Last edited by Dlanor Sekao; 07-03-2015 at 11:34 AM.
07-04-2015, 09:10 AM   #28
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Here is a K1000 Service Manual I found on the Pentax-Manuals web site. The password for all manuals is "Pentax"

http://www.pentax-manuals.com/markroberts/k1000_man.pdf

Happy reading!

Phil.
07-04-2015, 07:33 PM   #29
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The attached pic is a scan from a photocopy of a Pentax dealer accessories brochure. I don't know the date, but it is in the PZ era and there appears to be a full suite of FA lenses. In any case it would appear that the K1000SE was sufficiently well known that it is listed in an official US dealer's manual. (It refers to PZ cameras not Z cameras so I assume that it is a US manual).

FWIW, my first K1000 which I bought new in 1982 here in Australia had a split image screen but wasn't sold as a special edition. I don't remember it having the outer microprism grid, but that was a long time ago and I no longer have it to check. Of my three K1000SE bodies, the AIHK bodies both have an outer ground glass circle around the microprism and split image while the AIC body only has the split image and microprism.
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07-05-2015, 09:02 AM   #30
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I don't want to argue with any of you long standing collectors and repair Guys. Im just a noob at all this and probably got it all wrong anyway. Its confusing reading the service and repair manuals when things keep getting referenced back to Spotmatics and such.....gets very confusing.
I have what I have...... and Im sorry I even came on here to post my recent find that I was so happy to be reunited with...... the exact model K1000 that I used in High school........a crappy fake model SE and third party re-covered POS....... I hope a couple of You got your Kicks spanking me....

Getting some more film today for testing and will probably have to send to Eric to replace the now deteriorated door seals.....maybe I will get lucky and they wont leak in spite of needing replaced.....Im keeping this Fuggly one to replace the K1000 I murdered last fall when I drove off and left it on the roof with a SMC-K 24mm attached !

Last edited by Dlanor Sekao; 07-05-2015 at 09:11 AM.
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