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03-22-2016, 03:51 PM   #31
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thanks for the info!
What would you say about the numerous MZ-variants? They can be had quite cheap, and I see lots of people still use them. Are there any to be avoided, do they all feature some kind of split prism/screen or whatever the difference is?

04-04-2016, 01:48 AM   #32
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K1000 is expensive cause it is less likely to go wrong when you may need to buy a replacement cause that is cheaper than wait for repair... All the others have fancy gizmos you don't need.

A even older Spotmatic or earlier unmetered camera has a higher build quality and may be cheaper.

A separate meter is more accurate easier to use...
04-04-2016, 03:59 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by quh86 Quote
thanks for the info!
What would you say about the numerous MZ-variants? They can be had quite cheap, and I see lots of people still use them. Are there any to be avoided, do they all feature some kind of split prism/screen or whatever the difference is?
Many of them are quite good - I have an MZ-3 which I really love. They are plasticky for certain and I doubt they'll be as long-lived as the older mechanicals, but that's not too big a worry since they're fairly cheap.
More than that however, you said you wanted a very good OVF experience, better than your K-3..... I can tell you that the two MZ variants I have are certainly better than the K3 and other DSLRs but if you want a VERY good OVF then look to the LX (expensive comparatively) or the MX, or even the KX. Fantastic viewfinders in these.
04-06-2016, 05:41 PM - 1 Like   #34
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OP probably long gone, but...

I recommend a Pentax KX or KM. Either one should be serviced, ideally by Eric Hendrickson.

Chris

04-07-2016, 09:19 AM   #35
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I'd recommend developing tank, changing bag and bulk loader.


ILFORD PHOTO - Processing a Black & White film
04-07-2016, 11:21 AM   #36
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I started serious photography in the 80's with an ME Super - wonderful camera & I still use it. It has a phenomenal winder, the ME II which easily balances some heavy lenses. However, I have also shot many hundreds of rolls with the K1000. Once, in nowhere Africa, my battery died yet I still shot 20 plus rolls with just my judgement of settings. Even the slides came out amazing. It's a great "keep it simple stupid" camera. I learned everything about basic photography from my K1000. It taught me to become an intuitive photographer ... Fast forward, 30 years later, I am now back overseas w my MX (awesome viewfinder, it's immense) and my LX (great dust / weather gaskets/ exp comp and aperture priority). If my battery dies the LX is still useable. Both cameras are wonderful, rugged and proven; however, with my aging eyes, it's getting harder to pickup their viewfinder lights. Not so with the K1000 needle, very easy to know your exposure. My wife is using the K1000 while I'm deployed IOT get back to basics with her skills. I know soon enough manual focusing will be a challange for my eyes, and so it will be AF and digital, but for now there is still something magical about mechanical cameras to me. I've taken 30 years of memories with those and many others. The K1000 allows you to focus on the essentials without the distraction of lights, aperture priority or motor drives. They are also cheap to repair and maintain, and will last for many years. A trio of primes and you are back to basics. Good luck
04-07-2016, 03:59 PM - 2 Likes   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Xmas Quote
I'd recommend developing tank, changing bag and bulk loader.


ILFORD PHOTO - Processing a Black & White film
I think that's an answer to a different question.

---------- Post added 04-07-16 at 04:10 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Franbo Quote
I started serious photography in the 80's with an ME Super - wonderful camera & I still use it. It has a phenomenal winder, the ME II which easily balances some heavy lenses. However, I have also shot many hundreds of rolls with the K1000. Once, in nowhere Africa, my battery died yet I still shot 20 plus rolls with just my judgement of settings. Even the slides came out amazing. It's a great "keep it simple stupid" camera. I learned everything about basic photography from my K1000. It taught me to become an intuitive photographer ... Fast forward, 30 years later, I am now back overseas w my MX (awesome viewfinder, it's immense) and my LX (great dust / weather gaskets/ exp comp and aperture priority). If my battery dies the LX is still useable. Both cameras are wonderful, rugged and proven; however, with my aging eyes, it's getting harder to pickup their viewfinder lights. Not so with the K1000 needle, very easy to know your exposure. My wife is using the K1000 while I'm deployed IOT get back to basics with her skills. I know soon enough manual focusing will be a challange for my eyes, and so it will be AF and digital, but for now there is still something magical about mechanical cameras to me. I've taken 30 years of memories with those and many others. The K1000 allows you to focus on the essentials without the distraction of lights, aperture priority or motor drives. They are also cheap to repair and maintain, and will last for many years. A trio of primes and you are back to basics. Good luck
As always I too heartily recommend the K1000. Have had a couple over the years (though I no longer do). I'd add in terms of price/features, the KX is practically identical to the K1000, often found slighlty cheaper and has a few very useful and non-obtrusive (IMO) features beyond the K1000: full-information viewfinder, depth-of-field preview, and a self timer. I think there may be a couple other additions i'm forgetting but those are the big-ins. Oh! and mirror lockup as well (though I rarely use that).

Wondering what the OP wound up with, if anything yet.
04-08-2016, 01:17 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by chickentender Quote
I think that's an answer to a different question.

---------- Post added 04-07-16 at 04:10 PM ----------



As always I too heartily recommend the K1000. Have had a couple over the years (though I no longer do). I'd add in terms of price/features, the KX is practically identical to the K1000, often found slighlty cheaper and has a few very useful and non-obtrusive (IMO) features beyond the K1000: full-information viewfinder, depth-of-field preview, and a self timer. I think there may be a couple other additions i'm forgetting but those are the big-ins. Oh! and mirror lockup as well (though I rarely use that).

Wondering what the OP wound up with, if anything yet.
The OP is probably hiding...

A K1000 is missing lots of things that can go wrong that is why they are expensive, best to buy reliability. I have two cause they are easy to get - production volume...
An earlier non metered camera is better for learning with.
I'm still looking for a S1a.
Starting with sunny side /16 is the best way to learn! A hand held meter or built in one when you can use it...
And home processing is way better quality, when you figure out that fixing and wash air are critical.

I'll give you lots of people learnt different.

04-08-2016, 12:39 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Xmas Quote
The OP is probably hiding...

A K1000 is missing lots of things that can go wrong that is why they are expensive, best to buy reliability. I have two cause they are easy to get - production volume...
An earlier non metered camera is better for learning with.
I'm still looking for a S1a.
Starting with sunny side /16 is the best way to learn! A hand held meter or built in one when you can use it...
And home processing is way better quality, when you figure out that fixing and wash air are critical.

I'll give you lots of people learnt different.
Even if every additional function on the KX "goes wrong", you're still left with, for most intents and purposes, a K1000. IMO the three most important features NOT to have on a camera to be used for instruction are 1. auto-focus, 2. auto-aperture and 3. auto-shutter speed. I think it's difficult to argue that a KX is unreliable. That being said, pretty much any mechanical Pentax (or otherwise) fits the bill... I just think having those few other subtle features are nice to "grow into" and don't hinder the learning process, they are just added convenience such as being able to set a timer and include yourself in a photo. I'd also say that DOF preview is actually a hugely beneficial feature toward learning/understanding aperture and composition.

Last edited by chickentender; 04-08-2016 at 12:47 PM.
04-08-2016, 03:19 PM - 2 Likes   #40
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Killer App: DOF Preview

I gather many photographers never use depth of field preview.
Some can't even see the purpose; for my wife it just "darkens the screen".
And I'm not sure they know or care about the DOF scale on manual focus lenses.

Of course an experienced photographer knows what sort of DOF
they'll get at any given aperture with various focal length lenses.
I'm pretty confident most of the time, or I could use the lens scale,
but I prefer the confirmation DOF preview offers, and I seldom opt
to use an SLR without this feature. Wanna buy an ME Super?

DOF preview is a major reason I recommend a Pentax KX or KM over a K1000.
If someone really likes a K1000 I always try to steer them to a KM instead.

Chris
04-08-2016, 04:16 PM - 1 Like   #41
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I agree, KM or KX. You will benefit from DOF preview. I also still expect and use it with a manual camera. Then I never had a film camera that did not have DOF preview. It was important in the learning process, and then a useful check, always.
04-08-2016, 11:32 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by chickentender Quote
Even if every additional function on the KX "goes wrong", you're still left with, for most intents and purposes, a K1000. IMO the three most important features NOT to have on a camera to be used for instruction are 1. auto-focus, 2. auto-aperture and 3. auto-shutter speed. I think it's difficult to argue that a KX is unreliable. That being said, pretty much any mechanical Pentax (or otherwise) fits the bill... I just think having those few other subtle features are nice to "grow into" and don't hinder the learning process, they are just added convenience such as being able to set a timer and include yourself in a photo. I'd also say that DOF preview is actually a hugely beneficial feature toward learning/understanding aperture and composition.
You mean they have a built in selfie stick?

:[)
04-09-2016, 11:54 AM - 1 Like   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Xmas Quote
You mean they have a built in selfie stick?

:[)
Ugh. hahahahaha I just want to TAKE those from people and throw them in the ocean.

---------- Post added 04-09-16 at 12:07 PM ----------

All of the above is how I feel regarding features, especially DOF preview for a student camera. I think it's important to distinguish the difference between cost/simplicity for a "learner model" and the features that are very useful for instruction. The K1000 wasn't necessarily a "student" camera initially, it was a "budget" camera and had been stripped of many of these features to make it available at that price point. At the time the other features were still relatively new and a further premium had to be paid for a camera that included them - surely not within a student's budget. It was price that defined what the student camera was and why K1000s were purchased by so many schools. But these days the camera tiers from that era are largely blended, and the less known, less nostalgic KX and KM are often far cheaper, e.g. a better student camera from a price point as well.
In my opinion, a K1000 *does* make a good student camera, but it makes a far far better EXPERT camera - a body with absolute simplicity to be used by those that already understand photography (as mentioned above, those that can use the scale and already understand how aperture changes will affect the shot without need for a preview) and who would like to step back to something more pure. In a certain respect, it's along the same lines as the lovely medium format folders that i adore, and I assure you I won't suggest any of those as a first camera to anyone wanting to learn photography, unless they are really enamored with that style of camera to begin with.

Last edited by chickentender; 04-09-2016 at 12:12 PM.
04-09-2016, 12:55 PM   #44
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My daughter once attended an advanced B&W college course (6 weeks) at Ghost Ranch in Abiquiu, NM (think Ansel Adams landscapes). A fully-mechanical camera body was required for the course. She took my KX. A couple students didn't heed the requirement and were forced to rent K1000's or audit the course for no credit.

One of the requirements for the juried final portfolio was a self-portrait, which was well-nigh impossible for K1000 shooters. Meeting DoF requirements for specific assignments was also a challenge for them. In certain light conditions MLU and a tripod were necessary to obtain a good sharp exposure.

Those features are useful. It is IMO a subtle form of reverse snobbery to favor a K1000 over a currently less expensive KX or KM merely because a K1000 is deemed 'pure' without them
04-09-2016, 01:13 PM - 1 Like   #45
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I'm no expert

I would go KX or MX

I'm happy with MX for 5 or six tools a year.


It's possible to take a selfie with MX and M50 with one hand D
https://flic.kr/p/tRpDxh


And mirror https://flic.kr/p/tca6n6

Last edited by AldaCZ; 04-09-2016 at 01:20 PM.
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