Thinking about getting a film SLR. Suggestions? Requirements within.

LesDMess · 02-23-2018, 11:14 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by pres589

I just shot a 4 second or more shot in a bar last night. Being able to set the camera down on something sturdy and let it run out a while, without carrying a remote, is nice. It also seems even more important when I can't just jack the ISO up with the turn of a wheel like I can with a DSLR. It's not an every day thing but why limit myself?

You can turn the ISO wheel down a fair bit with film's seemingly limitless overexposure range compared to digital sensors though . . .

Even RAW files are completely unusable at +5 while Kodak Portra 400 just keeps going.

What this means in real life is if you come upon a scene that meters at 1/30 but you want 1/2 to smooth out the water and you don't happen to have any ND filters on you because you are on a 5 mile hike and you only brought a camera and lens, you simply overexpose the film knowing that you can just process at box speed and still achieve usable results like this on Fuji 100.

**pres589** · 02-23-2018, 11:50 AM

That's pretty amazing.

I think I'm the hunt for an XR2 or XR7.

**Kevin B123** · 02-23-2018, 12:08 PM

Here is a camera-lens compatibility listing for Pentax...
The Pentax Camera Lens Compatibility Chart
I agree the XR7 shown above looks to meet your requirements nicely.

stevebrot · 02-23-2018, 12:25 PM

Ricoh XR7 or Ricoh XR-2/XR-2s

Both are pictured below with winders attached and in company with the Pentax Super Program.

I prefer either of the Ricohs over the Super Program and suggest that the winders are a waste of money unless one REALLY wants one. The XR7 is a compact SLR and close in size to the Super Program and Pentax ME Super. The XR-2s is a little larger and almost identical in dimensions to the Pentax KX film camera. My first XR7 was purchased new in 1982 and would still be going strong except for an unfortunate accident with a defective lens in 2008. Its replacement is pictured above. I love the XR7 (it is a sweet camera in-hand), but consider the XR-2s my go-to 35mm SLR. It is pretty bulletproof. In terms of total flexibility, the XR7 wins.

Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 02-23-2018 at 01:19 PM.

**pres589** · 02-23-2018, 12:34 PM

Steve: I found similar posts from you here in the past when looking for information. I guess my only other question is how you find the needle vs. lights to show exposure. Is it an issue? Which do you prefer? Obviously you must be okay with the needles or you wouldn't like the XR's.

stevebrot · 02-23-2018, 12:48 PM

Originally posted by stevebrot

I love the XR7 (it is a sweet camera in-hand), but consider the XR-2s my go-to 35mm SLR. It is pretty bulletproof.

The two are essentially equivalent except:

CdS meter on the XR-2s vs. SPD on the XR7 (SPD is more sensitive in low light and faster)
Both have full-information viewfinders, though the XR7 is a little bigger/brighter
XR7 viewfinder shows exposure comp status (on/off), exposure lock status, and low battery. XR-2s shows low battery when battery check is pushed.
The self-timers on the XR-2s are almost universally broken at the switch due to stiff mechanism. The XR7's is electronic.
XR7 is smaller/lighter
XR-2s manual shutter speeds: 4s - 1/1000s + B + X
XR7 manual shutter speeds: 16s - 1/1000s + B + X
Aperture priority AE shutter ranges are the same as the manual ranges for each camera
XR7 has AE lock (important if subject is backlit and/or off-center and other stuff...I use this feature a lot)
Standard threaded cable release fitting on shutter button
Flash dedication with compatible flash on XR7 includes auto 1/125s in AE and flash-ready indicator, while XR-2s only supports flash-ready.

Shared features:

Both shutter speed and aperture are visible in viewfinder
Traditional controls
Aperture-priority auto-exposure with full support for metered manual
ISO 12-3200
+/- 2 stops exposure compensation
Hot shoe and dedicated flash (such as it is) with compatible units
Flash sync at 1/125s and slower
PC flash port
Electronic Copal metal shutter (camera is battery dependent)
Pentax-style magic fingers film take-up spool
Accept powered winder
Compatible with all K-mount lenses having an aperture ring

Steve

stevebrot · 02-23-2018, 12:57 PM

Originally posted by pres589

Steve: I found similar posts from you here in the past when looking for information. I guess my only other question is how you find the needle vs. lights to show exposure. Is it an issue? Which do you prefer? Obviously you must be okay with the needles or you wouldn't like the XR's.

The LCD "needle" on the XR7 works well, but can be hard to see in dim light. The flip side is that the XR7 is extremely easy on battery life, due in part to the display.

The viewfinder on the XR-2s is a virtual twin to that on the Pentax KX and very clear even in dim light. My only complaint is that unlike the KX, moving needle position in manual mode requires continous half-press to stay active. The XR7s meter and "needle" stay active on a timer (4 minutes?) so one just forgets about them once activated.

I have a mild preference for the XR-2s display, though sort of mentally shrug at the question.

Steve

**ChrisPlatt** · 02-23-2018, 04:40 PM - **3 Likes**

There are lots of interesting SLRs out there, but remember only Pentax has Eric Hendrickson.

Chris

kneemeister · 02-23-2018, 09:48 PM

The Chinon CP-5 and its sibling the Sears KSX-P dual program fits the bill also, and it works in program mode with any K-mount lens, K, M, A, KR, etc. I have both and they are the cameras I grab for a weekend car trip as they take AAA batteries and are built like plastic tanks.
I dont use my Ricohs of the same vintage XR-P and KR-30SP as I have found that the electronics will fail with no warning as they approach 40 years old.
For the Pre Program era I love my Ricohs (XR-7, XR-2) for the same reasons the above posters mention.

For non K-mount I really love my Nikon F-3

Xmas · 02-25-2018, 04:10 AM

You can use Ilford XP2 from 50-800 ISO with normal mini lab processing.
And get reasonable lab prints or wet print with an enlarger...

mohb · 02-25-2018, 05:26 AM

Out of curiosity , I have an XR-X which seems to be the last SLR that Ricoh made - did they just give up with the advent of AF?

**pres589** · 02-25-2018, 05:40 PM

The CP-5 sounds interesting but isn't really quite there vs. my original list. I do like that it uses AAA batteries in the built-in grip, and the program modes seem really nice for quickly changing "modes of use", if that makes sense.

Xmas, there's a developing lab in the Kansas City area, near where I work that I was planning on going to after I've shot a few roles. Any reason why I can't just order a few different kinds of film rolls from Amazon or a similar vendor and take them in? Was thinking about a roll of Tri-X, HP5, and Porta 400 each, just to see what I think of each. I know this is a newbie question but I'm trying to keep informed enough without getting overloaded with information.

**ChrisPlatt** · 03-01-2018, 02:45 PM

My first K-mount camera was a Ricoh.
I have tried a few other brands as well.

There's nothing like a Pentax.

Chris

**aslyfox** · 03-01-2018, 04:45 PM

this info may be of interest

Pentax K-Mount Lenses Explained: The differences between various Pentax lens series

The Evolution of the Pentax K-mount - Articles and Tips | PentaxForums.com

**pres589** · 03-02-2018, 09:18 PM

Les was kind enough to loan me his XR7. I'll be trying it out with a variety of lenses; my Samyang 14, a Kiron 28 f2.0, a DA 35 f2.4 (I know it's going to be limited to wide open the whole time) and an M 50 1.4. I've got a few different rolls of film, all ISO 400, some of which I'll want pushed to 1600.

Eventually I should have something to share. I'll probably have questions which I'll post to here as well as any sort of results. The only real fear I have is making sure exposure is correct. DoF Preview in M mode on my K-5 II is easier to believe in, if that makes sense.

02-23-2018, 12:48 PM	#21
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by stevebrot I love the XR7 (it is a sweet camera in-hand), but consider the XR-2s my go-to 35mm SLR. It is pretty bulletproof. The two are essentially equivalent except: CdS meter on the XR-2s vs. SPD on the XR7 (SPD is more sensitive in low light and faster) Both have full-information viewfinders, though the XR7 is a little bigger/brighter XR7 viewfinder shows exposure comp status (on/off), exposure lock status, and low battery. XR-2s shows low battery when battery check is pushed. The self-timers on the XR-2s are almost universally broken at the switch due to stiff mechanism. The XR7's is electronic. XR7 is smaller/lighter XR-2s manual shutter speeds: 4s - 1/1000s + B + X XR7 manual shutter speeds: 16s - 1/1000s + B + X Aperture priority AE shutter ranges are the same as the manual ranges for each camera XR7 has AE lock (important if subject is backlit and/or off-center and other stuff...I use this feature a lot) Standard threaded cable release fitting on shutter button Flash dedication with compatible flash on XR7 includes auto 1/125s in AE and flash-ready indicator, while XR-2s only supports flash-ready. Shared features: Both shutter speed and aperture are visible in viewfinder Traditional controls Aperture-priority auto-exposure with full support for metered manual ISO 12-3200 +/- 2 stops exposure compensation Hot shoe and dedicated flash (such as it is) with compatible units Flash sync at 1/125s and slower PC flash port Electronic Copal metal shutter (camera is battery dependent) Pentax-style magic fingers film take-up spool Accept powered winder Compatible with all K-mount lenses having an aperture ring Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 02-23-2018 at 01:18 PM.

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02-23-2018, 11:14 AM - 1 Like	#16
LesDMess Pentaxian Join Date: May 2011 Location: Santa Cruz, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,235	Originally posted by pres589 I just shot a 4 second or more shot in a bar last night. Being able to set the camera down on something sturdy and let it run out a while, without carrying a remote, is nice. It also seems even more important when I can't just jack the ISO up with the turn of a wheel like I can with a DSLR. It's not an every day thing but why limit myself? You can turn the ISO wheel down a fair bit with film's seemingly limitless overexposure range compared to digital sensors though . . . Even RAW files are completely unusable at +5 while Kodak Portra 400 just keeps going. What this means in real life is if you come upon a scene that meters at 1/30 but you want 1/2 to smooth out the water and you don't happen to have any ND filters on you because you are on a 5 mile hike and you only brought a camera and lens, you simply overexpose the film knowing that you can just process at box speed and still achieve usable results like this on Fuji 100.

02-23-2018, 11:50 AM	#17
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,528 Original Poster	That's pretty amazing. I think I'm the hunt for an XR2 or XR7.

02-23-2018, 12:08 PM	#18
Kevin B123 Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Hampshire Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,175	Here is a camera-lens compatibility listing for Pentax... The Pentax Camera Lens Compatibility Chart I agree the XR7 shown above looks to meet your requirements nicely.

02-23-2018, 12:25 PM	#19
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Ricoh XR7 or Ricoh XR-2/XR-2s Both are pictured below with winders attached and in company with the Pentax Super Program. I prefer either of the Ricohs over the Super Program and suggest that the winders are a waste of money unless one REALLY wants one. The XR7 is a compact SLR and close in size to the Super Program and Pentax ME Super. The XR-2s is a little larger and almost identical in dimensions to the Pentax KX film camera. My first XR7 was purchased new in 1982 and would still be going strong except for an unfortunate accident with a defective lens in 2008. Its replacement is pictured above. I love the XR7 (it is a sweet camera in-hand), but consider the XR-2s my go-to 35mm SLR. It is pretty bulletproof. In terms of total flexibility, the XR7 wins. Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 02-23-2018 at 01:19 PM.

02-23-2018, 12:34 PM	#20
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,528 Original Poster	Steve: I found similar posts from you here in the past when looking for information. I guess my only other question is how you find the needle vs. lights to show exposure. Is it an issue? Which do you prefer? Obviously you must be okay with the needles or you wouldn't like the XR's.

02-23-2018, 12:57 PM	#22
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by pres589 Steve: I found similar posts from you here in the past when looking for information. I guess my only other question is how you find the needle vs. lights to show exposure. Is it an issue? Which do you prefer? Obviously you must be okay with the needles or you wouldn't like the XR's. The LCD "needle" on the XR7 works well, but can be hard to see in dim light. The flip side is that the XR7 is extremely easy on battery life, due in part to the display. The viewfinder on the XR-2s is a virtual twin to that on the Pentax KX and very clear even in dim light. My only complaint is that unlike the KX, moving needle position in manual mode requires continous half-press to stay active. The XR7s meter and "needle" stay active on a timer (4 minutes?) so one just forgets about them once activated. I have a mild preference for the XR-2s display, though sort of mentally shrug at the question. Steve

02-23-2018, 04:40 PM - 3 Likes	#23
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,692	There are lots of interesting SLRs out there, but remember only Pentax has Eric Hendrickson. Chris

02-23-2018, 09:48 PM	#24
kneemeister Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Pittsford, Michigan Photos: Albums Posts: 89	The Chinon CP-5 and its sibling the Sears KSX-P dual program fits the bill also, and it works in program mode with any K-mount lens, K, M, A, KR, etc. I have both and they are the cameras I grab for a weekend car trip as they take AAA batteries and are built like plastic tanks. I dont use my Ricohs of the same vintage XR-P and KR-30SP as I have found that the electronics will fail with no warning as they approach 40 years old. For the Pre Program era I love my Ricohs (XR-7, XR-2) for the same reasons the above posters mention. For non K-mount I really love my Nikon F-3

02-25-2018, 04:10 AM	#25
Xmas Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 617	You can use Ilford XP2 from 50-800 ISO with normal mini lab processing. And get reasonable lab prints or wet print with an enlarger...

02-25-2018, 05:26 AM	#26
mohb Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 1,912	Out of curiosity , I have an XR-X which seems to be the last SLR that Ricoh made - did they just give up with the advent of AF?

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02-25-2018, 05:40 PM	#27
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,528 Original Poster	The CP-5 sounds interesting but isn't really quite there vs. my original list. I do like that it uses AAA batteries in the built-in grip, and the program modes seem really nice for quickly changing "modes of use", if that makes sense. Xmas, there's a developing lab in the Kansas City area, near where I work that I was planning on going to after I've shot a few roles. Any reason why I can't just order a few different kinds of film rolls from Amazon or a similar vendor and take them in? Was thinking about a roll of Tri-X, HP5, and Porta 400 each, just to see what I think of each. I know this is a newbie question but I'm trying to keep informed enough without getting overloaded with information.

03-01-2018, 02:45 PM	#28
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,692	My first K-mount camera was a Ricoh. I have tried a few other brands as well. There's nothing like a Pentax. Chris

03-01-2018, 04:45 PM	#29
aslyfox Seeker of Knowledge Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Topeka, Kansas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 24,576	this info may be of interest Pentax K-Mount Lenses Explained: The differences between various Pentax lens series The Evolution of the Pentax K-mount - Articles and Tips \| PentaxForums.com

03-02-2018, 09:18 PM	#30
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,528 Original Poster	Les was kind enough to loan me his XR7. I'll be trying it out with a variety of lenses; my Samyang 14, a Kiron 28 f2.0, a DA 35 f2.4 (I know it's going to be limited to wide open the whole time) and an M 50 1.4. I've got a few different rolls of film, all ISO 400, some of which I'll want pushed to 1600. Eventually I should have something to share. I'll probably have questions which I'll post to here as well as any sort of results. The only real fear I have is making sure exposure is correct. DoF Preview in M mode on my K-5 II is easier to believe in, if that makes sense.