Thinking about getting a film SLR. Suggestions? Requirements within.

**pres589** · 03-03-2018, 04:06 PM

Are all threaded cable releases the same? Meaning, if I bought a cable release, can I get a reputable part from another manufacturer? There's Nikon AR-3 cable releases for about $20 and I've got easy access to some areas without light pollution. Was thinking about that Samyang 14, and setting it so I could get some star trails, say stop down to f8, Porta 400 not pushed at all, and let it rip for an hour or so on a tripod.

Feedback very appreciated.

LesDMess · 03-03-2018, 08:31 PM

Instead of a specific Nikon AR-3, just search for mechanical cable shutter release because they are much cheaper then a branded one. Make sure it is the threaded kind which is universally accepted by cameras with threaded shutter buttons.

I believe someone else recommended this site to me that looks like it has good info -> Oleg Novikov Star trails photography tips

Praktica*ist · 03-04-2018, 10:29 AM

Originally posted by pres589

Les was kind enough to loan me his XR7. I'll be trying it out with a variety of lenses; my Samyang 14, a Kiron 28 f2.0, a DA 35 f2.4 (I know it's going to be limited to wide open the whole time) and an M 50 1.4. I've got a few different rolls of film, all ISO 400, some of which I'll want pushed to 1600.

Eventually I should have something to share. I'll probably have questions which I'll post to here as well as any sort of results. The only real fear I have is making sure exposure is correct. DoF Preview in M mode on my K-5 II is easier to believe in, if that makes sense.

As a side note to this interesting discussion : the DA 35 f/2.4 will be restricted to the smallest aperture with a non "A" generation camera. So it will be not really usable. You need this aperture ring, if you had a Pentax FA 35mm f/2 for example, you would be good to use it.

johnha · 03-04-2018, 11:16 AM

Originally posted by mohb

Out of curiosity , I have an XR-X which seems to be the last SLR that Ricoh made - did they just give up with the advent of AF?

Ricoh went in a different AF direction, they developed a standalone AF50mm lens, complete with IR based AF built-in, the Ricoh AF Rikenon 50mm F2: The Ricoh AF Rikenon 50 mm f/ 2 Lens. Specs. MTF Charts. User Reviews.

**pres589** · 03-04-2018, 01:32 PM

Originally posted by Praktica*ist

As a side note to this interesting discussion : the DA 35 f/2.4 will be restricted to the smallest aperture with a non "A" generation camera. So it will be not really usable. You need this aperture ring, if you had a Pentax FA 35mm f/2 for example, you would be good to use it.

Oh man, I thought it was the other way around. Yeah, that's not going to be so great. Unfortunate. I'm not going to buy a lens for this experiment; thankfully I have a good 28 and a good 50 already that work just fine with this type of camera.

Thanks for the heads up.

Vendee · 03-05-2018, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by stevebrot

The LCD "needle" on the XR7 works well, but can be hard to see in dim light. The flip side is that the XR7 is extremely easy on battery life, due in part to the display.

The viewfinder on the XR-2s is a virtual twin to that on the Pentax KX and very clear even in dim light. My only complaint is that unlike the KX, moving needle position in manual mode requires continous half-press to stay active. The XR7s meter and "needle" stay active on a timer (4 minutes?) so one just forgets about them once activated.

I have a mild preference for the XR-2s display, though sort of mentally shrug at the question.

Steve

Really interesting to hear about the various Ricoh models. I would be interested in something with a K mount that you can dial in 3200 ISO for low light but with a meter that you can read pretty much in the dark.

My MX and ME super have LED metering but only 1600 ISO. My K1000 has 3200 ISO but needle metering. I know there are workarounds but it would be nice to have something that did 3200 ISO and a meter you could read in the dark.

LesDMess · 03-05-2018, 06:19 AM

Originally posted by Vendee

I would be interested in something with a K mount that you can dial in 3200 ISO for low light but with a meter that you can read pretty much in the dark.

The Pentax LX uses LEDs for it's meter and can dial in ISO3200. Also, having the brightest and biggest viewfinder, it will help greatly in achieving critical focus in the darkest settings.

**pres589** · 03-05-2018, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by LesDMess

Instead of a specific Nikon AR-3, just search for mechanical cable shutter release because they are much cheaper then a branded one. Make sure it is the threaded kind which is universally accepted by cameras with threaded shutter buttons.

I believe someone else recommended this site to me that looks like it has good info -> Oleg Novikov Star trails photography tips

Thanks for the link to Oleg's site. That's probably one of the more easy-to-read walk-thru's I've seen.

Vendee · 03-05-2018, 08:47 AM

Originally posted by LesDMess

The Pentax LX uses LEDs for it's meter and can dial in ISO3200. Also, having the brightest and biggest viewfinder, it will help greatly in achieving critical focus in the darkest settings.

While I'd love an LX....... its out of my price range

**pres589** · 03-05-2018, 09:11 AM

I thought a lot of the later Pentax cameras used LED's for exposure display. The Super Program sounds kind of nice although it was further out from my criteria than the XR7. There's also the later plastic AF-era Pentax cameras that seem interesting although maybe aren't as reliable.

**gofour3** · 03-05-2018, 01:51 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Vendee

My MX and ME super have LED metering but only 1600 ISO. My K1000 has 3200 ISO but needle metering. I know there are workarounds but it would be nice to have something that did 3200 ISO and a meter you could read in the dark.

Originally posted by Vendee

While I'd love an LX....... its out of my price range

A Super A/Super Program would be a good option.

Phil.

**pres589** · 04-05-2018, 06:15 PM

Okay, so I've been using Les's XR7 for a few weeks now, and I've had three rolls of film developed by a lab that reviews well. Here are four pictures that I think show where I'm at. I had the lab scan these, I only resized with Photoshop Elements, to show them here.

I shot this one with Fuji Superia 400 with the camera set in A mode. Lens: Kiron 28mm f2.0 @ f2.0

Porta 400, Rokinon 14mm @ f2.8, camera in A mode.

T-Max 400, pushed 2 stops, with the camera set to 1600 on the ISO dial, 0 exposure compensation, A mode again. Lens: Pentax M 50 1.4 @ 1.4.

T-Max 400 @ 1600, A mode. Lens: Pentax M 50 1.4 @ 1.4.

That last one is kind of a good example of what I'm annoyed with. I can improve that somewhat in post-post processing with digital tools... The LCD indication of exposure is really difficult in some of the shots I took as they were taken in dark environments. The camera can drive itself to some pretty long exposure times... The club scene with all of the red is fairly repairable, I was surprised at all of the noise, I assume some of that is from aggressive sensitivity with the negative scanner?

Thoughts?

timw4mail · 04-06-2018, 10:02 AM

Exposing a scene with a bunch of light points as your light source is difficult to begin with.

The easiest way to fix that is to treat it as a backlit scene, and intentionally overexpose a stop or so.

Negative film handles overexposure really well, so going overly aggressive with the exposure can't hurt to start.

**pres589** · 04-06-2018, 10:12 AM

Yeah, I've taken to setting the exposure compensation to +.67 or +1 since I got these back. It's hard with the display on the XR7 to know if I'm under or over exposing when in a dark area due to the non-illuminated nature of the "needle". If I could go back and do that last shot again, I would probably set my 50 f1.4 to 1.4, 1/8th of a second, and see what the pushed-to-1600 TMAX would give me.

It's frustrating that A mode worked fine for me on the third shot, but not others. I'm curious if a different body would have done better here and maybe had a nicer light meter display as well.

timw4mail · 04-06-2018, 10:41 AM

Originally posted by pres589

Yeah, I've taken to setting the exposure compensation to +.67 or +1 since I got these back. It's hard with the display on the XR7 to know if I'm under or over exposing when in a dark area due to the non-illuminated nature of the "needle". If I could go back and do that last shot again, I would probably set my 50 f1.4 to 1.4, 1/8th of a second, and see what the pushed-to-1600 TMAX would give me.

It's frustrating that A mode worked fine for me on the third shot, but not others. I'm curious if a different body would have done better here and maybe had a nicer light meter display as well.

I'm not sure if the XR7 has center-weighted or matrix metering, but I don't see that kind of scene exposing well with an in-camera meter in general.

03-03-2018, 08:31 PM	#32
LesDMess Pentaxian Join Date: May 2011 Location: Santa Cruz, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,235	Instead of a specific Nikon AR-3, just search for mechanical cable shutter release because they are much cheaper then a branded one. Make sure it is the threaded kind which is universally accepted by cameras with threaded shutter buttons. I believe someone else recommended this site to me that looks like it has good info -> Oleg Novikov Star trails photography tips Last edited by LesDMess; 03-03-2018 at 08:38 PM.

04-05-2018, 06:15 PM	#42
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	Okay, so I've been using Les's XR7 for a few weeks now, and I've had three rolls of film developed by a lab that reviews well. Here are four pictures that I think show where I'm at. I had the lab scan these, I only resized with Photoshop Elements, to show them here. I shot this one with Fuji Superia 400 with the camera set in A mode. Lens: Kiron 28mm f2.0 @ f2.0 Porta 400, Rokinon 14mm @ f2.8, camera in A mode. T-Max 400, pushed 2 stops, with the camera set to 1600 on the ISO dial, 0 exposure compensation, A mode again. Lens: Pentax M 50 1.4 @ 1.4. T-Max 400 @ 1600, A mode. Lens: Pentax M 50 1.4 @ 1.4. That last one is kind of a good example of what I'm annoyed with. I can improve that somewhat in post-post processing with digital tools... The LCD indication of exposure is really difficult in some of the shots I took as they were taken in dark environments. The camera can drive itself to some pretty long exposure times... The club scene with all of the red is fairly repairable, I was surprised at all of the noise, I assume some of that is from aggressive sensitivity with the negative scanner? Thoughts? Last edited by pres589; 04-05-2018 at 07:02 PM.

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03-03-2018, 04:06 PM	#31
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	Are all threaded cable releases the same? Meaning, if I bought a cable release, can I get a reputable part from another manufacturer? There's Nikon AR-3 cable releases for about $20 and I've got easy access to some areas without light pollution. Was thinking about that Samyang 14, and setting it so I could get some star trails, say stop down to f8, Porta 400 not pushed at all, and let it rip for an hour or so on a tripod. Feedback very appreciated.

03-04-2018, 10:29 AM	#33
Praktica*ist Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: France, near Paris Posts: 57	Originally posted by pres589 Les was kind enough to loan me his XR7. I'll be trying it out with a variety of lenses; my Samyang 14, a Kiron 28 f2.0, a DA 35 f2.4 (I know it's going to be limited to wide open the whole time) and an M 50 1.4. I've got a few different rolls of film, all ISO 400, some of which I'll want pushed to 1600. Eventually I should have something to share. I'll probably have questions which I'll post to here as well as any sort of results. The only real fear I have is making sure exposure is correct. DoF Preview in M mode on my K-5 II is easier to believe in, if that makes sense. As a side note to this interesting discussion : the DA 35 f/2.4 will be restricted to the smallest aperture with a non "A" generation camera. So it will be not really usable. You need this aperture ring, if you had a Pentax FA 35mm f/2 for example, you would be good to use it.

03-04-2018, 11:16 AM	#34
johnha Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Lancashire, UK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,155	Originally posted by mohb Out of curiosity , I have an XR-X which seems to be the last SLR that Ricoh made - did they just give up with the advent of AF? Ricoh went in a different AF direction, they developed a standalone AF50mm lens, complete with IR based AF built-in, the Ricoh AF Rikenon 50mm F2: The Ricoh AF Rikenon 50 mm f/ 2 Lens. Specs. MTF Charts. User Reviews.

03-04-2018, 01:32 PM	#35
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	Originally posted by Prakticaist As a side note to this interesting discussion : the DA 35 f/2.4 will be restricted to the smallest aperture* with a non "A" generation camera. So it will be not really usable. You need this aperture ring, if you had a Pentax FA 35mm f/2 for example, you would be good to use it. Oh man, I thought it was the other way around. Yeah, that's not going to be so great. Unfortunate. I'm not going to buy a lens for this experiment; thankfully I have a good 28 and a good 50 already that work just fine with this type of camera. Thanks for the heads up.

03-05-2018, 01:53 AM	#36
Vendee Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Norfolk, UK Posts: 1,134	Originally posted by stevebrot The LCD "needle" on the XR7 works well, but can be hard to see in dim light. The flip side is that the XR7 is extremely easy on battery life, due in part to the display. The viewfinder on the XR-2s is a virtual twin to that on the Pentax KX and very clear even in dim light. My only complaint is that unlike the KX, moving needle position in manual mode requires continous half-press to stay active. The XR7s meter and "needle" stay active on a timer (4 minutes?) so one just forgets about them once activated. I have a mild preference for the XR-2s display, though sort of mentally shrug at the question. Steve Really interesting to hear about the various Ricoh models. I would be interested in something with a K mount that you can dial in 3200 ISO for low light but with a meter that you can read pretty much in the dark. My MX and ME super have LED metering but only 1600 ISO. My K1000 has 3200 ISO but needle metering. I know there are workarounds but it would be nice to have something that did 3200 ISO and a meter you could read in the dark.

03-05-2018, 06:19 AM	#37
LesDMess Pentaxian Join Date: May 2011 Location: Santa Cruz, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,235	Originally posted by Vendee I would be interested in something with a K mount that you can dial in 3200 ISO for low light but with a meter that you can read pretty much in the dark. The Pentax LX uses LEDs for it's meter and can dial in ISO3200. Also, having the brightest and biggest viewfinder, it will help greatly in achieving critical focus in the darkest settings.

03-05-2018, 07:49 AM	#38
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	Originally posted by LesDMess Instead of a specific Nikon AR-3, just search for mechanical cable shutter release because they are much cheaper then a branded one. Make sure it is the threaded kind which is universally accepted by cameras with threaded shutter buttons. I believe someone else recommended this site to me that looks like it has good info -> Oleg Novikov Star trails photography tips Thanks for the link to Oleg's site. That's probably one of the more easy-to-read walk-thru's I've seen.

03-05-2018, 08:47 AM	#39
Vendee Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Norfolk, UK Posts: 1,134	Originally posted by LesDMess The Pentax LX uses LEDs for it's meter and can dial in ISO3200. Also, having the brightest and biggest viewfinder, it will help greatly in achieving critical focus in the darkest settings. While I'd love an LX....... its out of my price range

03-05-2018, 09:11 AM	#40
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	I thought a lot of the later Pentax cameras used LED's for exposure display. The Super Program sounds kind of nice although it was further out from my criteria than the XR7. There's also the later plastic AF-era Pentax cameras that seem interesting although maybe aren't as reliable.

03-05-2018, 01:51 PM - 1 Like	#41
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,090	Originally posted by Vendee My MX and ME super have LED metering but only 1600 ISO. My K1000 has 3200 ISO but needle metering. I know there are workarounds but it would be nice to have something that did 3200 ISO and a meter you could read in the dark. Originally posted by Vendee While I'd love an LX....... its out of my price range A Super A/Super Program would be a good option. Phil.

04-06-2018, 10:02 AM	#43
timw4mail Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Driving a Mirage Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,670	Exposing a scene with a bunch of light points as your light source is difficult to begin with. The easiest way to fix that is to treat it as a backlit scene, and intentionally overexpose a stop or so. Negative film handles overexposure really well, so going overly aggressive with the exposure can't hurt to start.

04-06-2018, 10:12 AM	#44
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529 Original Poster	Yeah, I've taken to setting the exposure compensation to +.67 or +1 since I got these back. It's hard with the display on the XR7 to know if I'm under or over exposing when in a dark area due to the non-illuminated nature of the "needle". If I could go back and do that last shot again, I would probably set my 50 f1.4 to 1.4, 1/8th of a second, and see what the pushed-to-1600 TMAX would give me. It's frustrating that A mode worked fine for me on the third shot, but not others. I'm curious if a different body would have done better here and maybe had a nicer light meter display as well.

04-06-2018, 10:41 AM	#45
timw4mail Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Driving a Mirage Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,670	Originally posted by pres589 Yeah, I've taken to setting the exposure compensation to +.67 or +1 since I got these back. It's hard with the display on the XR7 to know if I'm under or over exposing when in a dark area due to the non-illuminated nature of the "needle". If I could go back and do that last shot again, I would probably set my 50 f1.4 to 1.4, 1/8th of a second, and see what the pushed-to-1600 TMAX would give me. It's frustrating that A mode worked fine for me on the third shot, but not others. I'm curious if a different body would have done better here and maybe had a nicer light meter display as well. I'm not sure if the XR7 has center-weighted or matrix metering, but I don't see that kind of scene exposing well with an in-camera meter in general.