[Swift1]

I have a long-standing desire for an FE2. There, I said it.


Steve

(...desire has been thwarted by a lack of bodies at a magic price point...)

I very briefly had 2 different FE2...
They are nice cameras but for one very irritating feature... The meter (and AE) doesn't work until the frame counter reaches 1...

[UncleVanya]

I loved the FE and FM when I was shooting my Nikon Nikkormat FT3 and later my F2a - The FT3 also had the ASA around the lens - I never found that to be an issue - of course it also had the shutter speed around the lens which confused first time users a lot. I found the FM/FE virtually identical. The manual cameras of that day were so easy to adjust that I didn't worry a bit over the slight automation advantage of the FE - either one was fine - typically with a winder.

As for Pentax - other than the LX and some brief work with K1000 and then my long use of the PZ-1 I am really out of my depth. The MX was a favorite of some of my friends so I would have recommended it but for the expressed objection. The LX is still on my list of wishes - not so much for now - but for what I wished I had been able to shoot in the heyday of the camera.

[stevebrot]

In terms of cold weather, I thought the Super Program also had a remote battery holder (so the batteries can live in your jacket pocket while you shoot)

I have never heard of any external power adapter for the Super Program and my copy has no obvious fitting for such.


Steve

[bjolester]

Thank you all for commenting, it is very interesting to read about your experience with Pentax and Nikon cameras.

The K2 I owned before had been CLA’d by Eric Hendrickson and was in very good condition. It was in all respects a beautiful camera. But somehow I did not enjoy photographing with it, it was left on the bookshelf when I went out with my KX or MX cameras. So, when I purchased my Pentax K-5iis, I needed money, and sold the K2.

The MX is not identical in size to the ME, it is slightly wider, enabling the space for the Spotmatic shutter. The MX is also characterised by having a very high mechanical build quality, even though the top and bottom covers are quite thin and fragile. I have used the MX for photographing the northern lights, being out for many hours at a time in the Norwegian winter night, and the MX has been 100% reliable. Even in the coldest winter conditions, no problems at all. The same thing applies for the KX. I would not have dared to bring along a ME or ME Super in similar weather conditions, in fear of a camera breakdown. I wonder how the plastic on/off program switch on the ME Super would have behaved after a few hours in minus 20˚ celsius (minus 4 fahrenheit)?

I purchased the Nikon FE and FE2 some weeks ago, and am now finished with installing Jon Goodman’s sealing kits on the cameras. I am very much looking forward to start using them. Based on handling these cameras only for a brief time, I would not hesitate to use them in cold weather, the way I use the MX and KX. The Nikons seem to be build to a very high standard. The only major negative aspect with the Nikon FE/FE2 cameras is that my wonderful Pentax lenses cannot be fitted onto them...

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Last edited by bjolester; 09-02-2018 at 01:28 PM.

[TwoUptons]

I have never heard of any external power adapter for the Super Program and my copy has no obvious fitting for such.


Steve

It screws in to the battery compartment. Really, all it is is a remote battery holder and a long wire that ends in a spring loaded fitting (presumably) that fits where the batteries would be otherwise.

I always thought it would be weird to use. I figured I would set up a shot, decide I was cold, go back to the car, and pull the camera over when I got to the end of the wire...

Hilariously, it shows up in the 1987 vintage accessory guide as the “Battery Cord LX/A” that was sitting two meters away...
The LX one fit the LX and the A fits all the A/M cameras except the ME-F and MX, for obvious reasons...

-Eric

[johnha]

My only reservation with the Super-A (Super Program) is the LCDs for the metering - almost impossible to see in the dark (or wearing a peaked cap) - there's a light to illuminate them but it eats the battery and mine flickers quite a bit), better to shine a flash light on the opaque panel from the outside. The LX is far and away the most reassuring Pentax 35mm with auto-exposure, it's the nicest to shoot as well - all dials feel much smoother and click into place more positively, the film advance is very smooth. The drawback is finding one for the right price (if it hasn't been repaired for a sticky mirror it will almost certainly require it at some point). It's ergonomics are much better for me than the MX (the shutter speed dial is easier to turn with the camera held up to the eye) and it's better 'weather sealed' than pretty much anything else from the '80s. The OTF metering during the actual exposure may be a benefit for shooting the Northern Lights.

[LesDMess]

I guess there are many of you that use multiple camera systems. Does it make sense to have a small Nikon auto exposure 35mm film camera kit or is the Pentax LX a better option?

I would appreciate hearing your experience on auto exposure cameras and owning multiple systems.

-Bjørn

These are the manual cameras I have used that have aperture priority although there are a few here that have additional automatic exposure modes of shutter priority and program.



Whether the LX would be a more useful camera for you will depend on how you use it. For instance, it is the only camera that can aperture priority a scene for as long as it takes - all the while monitoring it for lighting changes and adjusting accordingly. I have personally tested both of mine for exposure taking more then several hours long successfully and repeatedly. Only the Olympus OM 2 can come a very distant second to this as the longest it can do is 19 minutes under very special settings. All Canons max out at 30 seconds exactly while Nikon, Minolta and Pentax (other then the LX) varies with every model and not consistent

Another feature is that the LX has shutter speeds sync to 1/2000 available without batteries. This is shared by the ES II and Canon New F-1. The Nikon FM3A is the merger of the FE2/FM2 and has all shutter speeds available when batteries die. All others may have sync speed available when batteries die.

Noteworthy:
Olympus OM4 has spot metering.
Chinon CE II Memotron works with M42 lenses.
Minolta XE-7 has the smoothest film advance I have ever felt on all cameras.
Minolta X-700 has a full intervalometer available.
Nikon FG is the little train that could.
Ricoh XR7 is a Pentax mount and a good alternative to the ME Super.
The Nikon FA is feature laden version of the FE2.

What I don't like about the Nikon F3/FA/FG/FE2 is that their meters are disabled until the film has been advanced to position 1. Clearly an overreach by Nikon to keep users from getting a long exposure - and thinking their camera is broken, when they fire the shutter after putting a new roll of film in and advancing the film.

[stevebrot]

That's so you can quickly advance to frame 1, even with the lens cap on.
Thoughtful, and simply ingenious IMO.

Sort of like the feature on the Super Program where shutter speed is 1/1000s until frame one.


Steve

[ctrout]

Never had an ME Super long enough to notice that. Must check my ME-F to see if it does likewise.

Chris

The ME Super and ME F don't have that feature. Also, I agree with you on the Super Program. For most people shooting film, I think the program feature is a useless novelty. Most of us who shoot film have come to a point in our pursuit of the hobby where we think more about what goes into the exposure of each frame. We know how aperture and shutter speed will impact the look of the photo, so we want to have control over each one. Program mode offers no creative control over depth of field or motion in the picture. I have the ME Super, ME, ME F, Super Program, and Super A, so I feel qualified to offer my comparative opinion on them all when I say that the drawbacks of the exceptionally poor display in the Super Program/Super A viewfinder really kills the desireability of these cameras in contrast to the ME series, which all have lovely displays of shutter speed and exposure info. No, they don't tell you the aperture, but neither do the Super Program models. I would never consider the Super Program over the ME Super/ME F just to gain the very limited usefulness of program mode.

[stevebrot]

No, they don't tell you the aperture, but neither do the Super Program models.

Mine does, though only in Program, Tv, and 125/X modes. That being said, I agree that the Super Program/Super-A and Program-Plus/Program-A models viewfinder displays are less desirable is some ways. The choice of the LCD display seems dumb, but the concern at the time was battery life. Available LEDs were huge power hogs and LCD displays were presented as a solution and a premium feature.* Both A-series cameras proved to be a market success, though my preference for first-generation program bodies still lies with the P3n. The traditional shutter dial and ME-Super style M-mode win the day for me. Pity they are DX cartridge dependent.


Steve

* My Ricoh XR7 addresses the battery issue with a virtual LCD "bar" indicating the shutter speed. In the 35+ years using that model, low-light performance was seldom a problem due to the nature of the display. If it was too dim to seen the "bar" or the "over"/"under" indicators it was typically borderline dim for metered exposure without compensation for reciprocity failure (i.e. not auto-exposure territory). (Also rather difficult to focus )

[johnha]

The biggest problem with Pentax auto-exposure cameras is the lack of exposure lock on most of them - the only manual focus bodies having it are the P30, P50 & MZ-M. More have exposure compensation, but exposure lock is much easier to use. Because of this, I'm usually shooting manual (which is a pain on the Super-A).

[stevebrot]

the only manual focus bodies having it are the P30, P50 & MZ-M

P30n? MZ-S?

Details aside, the lack can be a pain. I like to use a gray card for metering and an AE lock button makes it a cinch.

Steve

[RKKS08]

About showing the aperture by a Super A/Super Program:
The camera only shows the aperture value when it has set it (plus the 125X).

Values set by the user with the aperture ring are not shown.

[leekil]

Sort of like the feature on the Super Program where shutter speed is 1/1000s until frame one.

But on the Super Program you can switch to the 125 setting and it will shutter-priority properly expose.

---------- Post added 09-03-18 at 08:49 PM ----------

I am not a huge fan of any manual exposure indication system, other than the center-needle one. The others seem much less user-friendly and visually obvious, and therefore slower to dial in the correct exposure. I would say there is possibly an impetus toward using auto-exposure modes due to that type of interface.

I *am* a huge fan of the modern DSLR dials for shutter speed (in particular) and aperture, where you can easily adjust them without looking at them. I liked the shutter speed buttons on the Super Program for that reason, compared to the traditional shutter speed dial, but am less enamored with it now. But I have recently gotten the idea that maybe people work the traditional shutter speed dials with their index finger while looking through the viewfinder, is that accurate? It seems a bit cumbersome if that is the design intent, only because the shutter speed dials seem recessed in a way that makes them less accessible than if they were further forward.

[stevebrot]

But I have recently gotten the idea that maybe people work the traditional shutter speed dials with their index finger while looking through the viewfinder, is that accurate? It seems a bit cumbersome if that is the design intent, only because the shutter speed dials seem recessed in a way that makes them less accessible than if they were further forward.

It depends on the camera. I have a few bodies where the shutter speed dial turns easily with the camera at the eye and a few others where one might draw blood getting it to move with a one-finger attempt. Being able to do so is most useful when shutter speed is visible in the viewfinder as it is on the better cameras being discussed on this thread. I can also think of a several cameras where the shutter dial is readily accessible at the front edge of the body (e.g. Ricoh XR7, Pentax P3n, X-series Minolta). My personal practice for manual exposure TTL metered cameras is to set the shutter speed first and do exposure adjustments using the aperture unless I have a strong need to shoot with a particular lens opening. Usually, I determine exposure in advance of the first shot and make the large adjustments to the shutter with the camera at my waist.

FWIW, while I have nothing against manual metered exposure, there is something amazingly intuitive to working with a full information viewfinder with aperture-priority auto exposure, particularly if the camera has provision for AE lock.


Steve