[Kosmo Foto]

Hello all - a very Happy New Year to everyone.

Last month Aaron Gold wrote a fantastic review of the ME Super on Kosmo Foto, and I thought I would share it here in case people hadn't seen it.

Pentax ME Super review (Kosmo Foto)

Having concentrated on Pentax M42 stuff, I've finally got a couple of K-mount cameras in the last few months - a Zenit-KM Plus and a Vivitar 3000s -so looking forward to adding a few Pentax K bodies aswell.

Cheers

S

[Dhebard]

My first SLR back in 1981 was a Pentax ME Super. I bought it while in the US Army, stationed on the Panama Canal. I put a lot of film through that little camera, and was very pleased with the camera and the pictures it took.

[stevebrot]

Last month Aaron Gold wrote a fantastic review of the ME Super on Kosmo Foto, and I thought I would share it here in case people hadn't seen it.

Back in the day, Consumer Reports magazine rated the Ricoh XR-2s over the ME Super and other 35mm SLRs of the day. My review of that camera is here on Pentax Forums:

Ricoh XR-2s - Third-Party Manual Focus Film SLRs - Pentax Camera Reviews and Specifications


Steve

[film-love]

Cool review! ME Super is so much fun to use. With aperture priority, I found it to be especially nice for spontaneous street snap -photography with the exposure compensation set to +1 whenever desired.


Coupla sidenotes though. On the take-up spool: "No doubt its purpose is to prevent mis-loading, but I would think that’s all but impossible with the ME Super."

--> Personally I would prefer a more traditional take-up spool. It once lost grip mid-roll... Not nice. It could be that I just didn't stick the film far enough, then I heard someone else had had that happen too. Ever since, just to be safe, I have always loaded my film (nowadays with the MX) like in this video:

You Tube

You Tube

"The ME Super has a good-but-not-great reputation for reliability, with jammed shutters (easy to fix)"

--> My ME Super is semi-jammed. I had it CLA'd professionally a few years ago and it worked perfectly for 6 months, then started giving non-exposed frames here and there, and then jammed up again - now it's in the storage room and I've gotten myself an MX.

It's my impression that ME Super shutters are a bit of a mystery, and overall it's not a very reliable camera - correct me if I'm wrong and I'd be happy to learn if the shutter is indeed an easy fix (?).

Strangely enough, mine fires every now and then and sometimes works for a little while - when it does, and doesn't give a non-exposed frame, it's dead accurate especially since the CLA / calibration. I have no idea why the shutter won't fire some/most of the time.

Other than that, I think it'd be right up there with the best.

[stevebrot]

Personally I would prefer a more traditional take-up spool. It once lost grip mid-roll... Not nice.

Of course that has little to do with the take-up spool design, but indicates that the drive sprockets (top and bottom) were not full engaged before closing the back. Strangely enough, the take-up spool does not draw the film across the film gate, that task is done by the sprockets with assistance from the pressure plate.

It's my impression that ME Super shutters are a bit of a mystery, and overall it's not a very reliable camera - correct me if I'm wrong and I'd be happy to learn if the shutter is indeed an easy fix (?).

The ME Super's shutter was Seiko's best for the time, is fully electronic + manual 1/125s and B, and is quite reliable to the limits of the mechanical release mechanism and supporting electronics. The rule of thumb with those cameras is that if they are fully operational after almost 40 years, they will like continue to be so with reasonable care. If the shutter itself or its controller is dead, neither is repairable.


Steve

[Lord Lucan]

Ever since, just to be safe, I have always loaded my film (nowadays with the MX) like in this video:

I was not sure of your point until I saw @3:14 that you had put the tongue right through to the other side of the "magic needles". I would worry that could make dents in the film wound on top of it. I also worried that you closed the back when the film was obviously quite slack as seen @3:22. I have always pressed the film down onto the runners with moderate friction while I took up a couple of turns using the winding lever, making sure the film is taut going into the take-up spool (if it is going to pull out it would do so then). I then close the back removing my fingers at the last moment.

[Huss]

I've had a few issues with the Magic Needles in my LX and SuperA. They have let go of the film, but luckily right at the beginning at the loading stage. For me I've found it helps to put less not more of the film leader into the needles.
Pentax thankfully saw the error of their ways by the time they introduced the P30 - my P30T has an autoloading system like an AF 35mm slr, P&S or Leica R9 which works perfectly.

[film-love]

The ME Super's shutter was Seiko's best for the time, is fully electronic + manual 1/125s and B, and is quite reliable to the limits of the mechanical release mechanism and supporting electronics. The rule of thumb with those cameras is that if they are fully operational after almost 40 years, they will like continue to be so with reasonable care. If the shutter itself or its controller is dead, neither is repairable.

Yeah, I did get a very reliable impression of that shutter before it/something failed. And while I prefer the MX over the MES, the winding feel of ME Super's metal shutter was lovely and firm. The only thing I don't like about my MX actually (even the stiffness of the speed dial is ok for me) is the uneven/sloppy feeling of the winder (I realize it's a different design with a cloth shutter and will have a different travel motion etc).

It could be the the electronics / controller (?) in the ME Super that failed on me - although to note, without batteries (using the 1/125 sync speed) it also only works occasionally and likes to jam up right after. This, after a proper CLA.

I was not sure of your point until I saw @3:14 that you had put the tongue right through to the other side of the "magic needles". I would worry that could make dents in the film wound on top of it. I also worried that you closed the back when the film was obviously quite slack as seen @3:22. I have always pressed the film down onto the runners with moderate friction while I took up a couple of turns using the winding lever, making sure the film is taut going into the take-up spool (if it is going to pull out it would do so then). I then close the back removing my fingers at the last moment.

Not my video btw - but I've loaded similarly these past couple of years. Always works, but loading takes too much time so I would actually prefer to go back to just sticking the film under the pins.

I've had a few issues with the Magic Needles in my LX and SuperA. They have let go of the film, but luckily right at the beginning at the loading stage. For me I've found it helps to put less not more of the film leader into the needles.

Again, not my video, but would you guys say this is a good amount of leader to stick under:

You Tube

You Tube

I'd be willing to go back to loading the film as originally intended just because it's way easier to do it on the road (=with my current method, making that little wedge to the end is tricky to do just with fingers alone and takes a few tries to get the film end popping back up from under the pins) but I really dislike having to second guess whether the film will lose grip in the middle of the roll.

If I remember correctly, the slip might have happened with one of those slightly thinner film brands, possibly Cinestill without its anti-halation layer. Could be that it had slightly less grip than usual, not sure, just guessing.

[Lord Lucan]

but would you guys say this is a good amount of leader to stick under: <video snipped>

The amount of leader he puts into the needles is about what I would do, but I would then wind a bit further than he did @0:27, I would wind until the original needle entry point was over-wrapped because that makes the leader far less likely to jump back out of the needles. I would also want to see the full film width appear from round the corner in the take-up spool so I could see it was snugly between the flanges, which he cannot see before he closes the back.

I have never had a film lose traction after I closed the back. I think the magic needle system was brilliant, and I could load film practically by muscle memory; loading was never an issue. I invariably used Kodak and Ilford film. My mother had a 1980s P&S with auto-loading and it played by the book and advanced to "Frame 1" as soon as you shut the back, as I understand all auto-loaders do. But with manual loading I always got an extra "Frame 0" and one or two extra at the other end too.

[film-love]

The amount of leader he puts into the needles is about what I would do, but I would then wind a bit further than he did @0:27, I would wind until the original needle entry point was over-wrapped because that makes the leader far less likely to jump back out of the needles. I would also want to see the full film width appear from round the corner in the take-up spool so I could see it was snugly between the flanges, which he cannot see before he closes the back.

Nice, I just might start doing this too. I kinda miss loading film in such an effortless way.

[womble]

It maybe because my first SLR was an ME Super (and my second a used MX) but I have never, in literally hundreds (?thousands) of rolls over 30 years, had a problem with loading the film using the magic needles. I guess it's what one is used to. OTOH, I'm all fingers and thumbs loading 120 roll film cameras.

[stevebrot]

Again, not my video, but would you guys say this is a good amount of leader to stick under:

I would say about the same as you use on your MX. It is simple...

1. Insert the tongue of the leader between the magic fingers and wind forward, noting that the lower sprocket engages as the film tightens across the film gate
2. Press the shutter (set at 1/125X, of course) and wind again, noting that the film is still tensioned across the film gate.
3. If both top and bottom sprockets are engaged with the film perforations, simply close the door and continue shutter-wind sequence until the counter is at "1". If not, repeat step two above. Note the rewind crank rotating as the film is advanced.

I would not worry too much if a bit sticks out the other side, but would note that there is no reason to have it do so.


Steve

[stevebrot]

OTOH, I'm all fingers and thumbs loading 120 roll film cameras.

Some TLRs are incredibly cumbersome.


Steve

[stevebrot]

I have never had a film lose traction after I closed the back. I think the magic needle system was brilliant, and I could load film practically by muscle memory; loading was never an issue.

I may have once or twice when I was fourteen years old and still learning, but figured out quickly to make sure the rewind lever was turning as I wound on. The magic needles were a wonderful thing in that there was no muss nor fuss. I have yet to put a roll through my Praktica Super TL3. Its take-up spool is something new to me (two metal bales either side of the axle...nothing more).


Steve

[film-love]

You guys've convinced me, my next roll will go in the regular way.

What might have happened, the time I did encounter problems, is that the leader may have moved/slipped a bit (under the white pins) during loading and me not noticing it before closing the back - leaving the leader -almost- flicking out from under one or two 'magic needles' and then barely clinging in there for 10 or so shots.