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05-17-2015, 11:36 AM   #11206
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
I see a hint of Helios 44 in this pic.
Ya, triplets do seem to have a bit of that Biotar swirl.

05-17-2015, 12:06 PM - 2 Likes   #11207
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
Thanks for the tip. This was my first experience with expired film. I shot two rolls but still have one left, but now I know what to expect. Under is still better than over I guess. Everything looked blue, I wonder what some different filters would do? I don't have much experience with filters either. Any suggestions? or just go with what I got?


Generally speaking, overexposing most negatives and b&w film - processed at normal box speed, results in finer grain while underexposing leads to coarser grain.


Also generally speaking, the farther past expiration date film gets, the slower it's real speed becomes relative to it's stated box speed.


Extreme example below of expired Fuji Superia 1600 that was 8 years expired but stored in freezer and processed at 1600. "0" is the box speed of 1600, +5 is shooting it at ISO50 and -4 is shooting it at ISO25600. These are just straight scans with no post processing applied.


Expired Fuji Superia 1600 latitude


I have conducted this test with other films and not all of them get finer grained when overexposed like this film did.
05-17-2015, 12:27 PM   #11208
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Thanks for the lesson guys. I'm currently trying out pushing and pulling on two different cameras right now. My 645 has Ilford Delta 100 at 400 and my Canon A-1 has Ilford HP5 400 at 100. Ya can't learn by just reading about it ya know, gotta actually do it.
05-17-2015, 03:23 PM - 4 Likes   #11209
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I haven't hiked or shot any photos for about a month, so it was good to get back out there again.

Here's one I shot with my large format film camera during a rainy/snowy hike out on the Colorado/Wyoming border.

Shot using my Zone VI 4x5 and Fujinon W 125mm F5.6 lens on Foma 200 at 120 ISO developed in Pyrocat MC for 8.5 minutes.



05-17-2015, 03:49 PM   #11210
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QuoteOriginally posted by Colorado CJ Quote
I haven't hiked or shot any photos for about a month, so it was good to get back out there again.

Here's one I shot with my large format film camera during a rainy/snowy hike out on the Colorado/Wyoming border.

Shot using my Zone VI 4x5 and Fujinon W 125mm F5.6 lens on Foma 200 at 120 ISO developed in Pyrocat MC for 8.5 minutes.

Very well done. I like how the foreground leads deep to the mountains, and then there's one that rises with the clouds pushing down. Very dynamic with the stillness of it. The detail is great. I like how the clouds and the mountain share textures, too, with the tension. Lovely photograph. Glad you got out!
David
05-17-2015, 07:12 PM   #11211
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QuoteOriginally posted by LesDMess Quote
Generally speaking, overexposing most negatives and b&w film - processed at normal box speed, results in finer grain while underexposing leads to coarser grain.


Also generally speaking, the farther past expiration date film gets, the slower it's real speed becomes relative to it's stated box speed.


Extreme example below of expired Fuji Superia 1600 that was 8 years expired but stored in freezer and processed at 1600. "0" is the box speed of 1600, +5 is shooting it at ISO50 and -4 is shooting it at ISO25600. These are just straight scans with no post processing applied.


Expired Fuji Superia 1600 latitude


I have conducted this test with other films and not all of them get finer grained when overexposed like this film did.
That's an interesting exercise. I always used to shoot Superia 200 2/3 a stop higher as I felt it gave better results. Looks like I could have gone further.
05-17-2015, 08:03 PM - 1 Like   #11212
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
Thanks for the tip. This was my first experience with expired film. I shot two rolls but still have one left, but now I know what to expect. Under is still better than over I guess. Everything looked blue, I wonder what some different filters would do? I don't have much experience with filters either. Any suggestions? or just go with what I got?
Given that print film doesn't mind being over exposed a bit and can often handle as much as two stops overexposure, and also given what can be done to white balance in today's PP software, if this were my film, I would shoot it at two stops under and not bother with any filters. I mean, if you wanted to try to correct using filters, which would you use, and how would you know it's the right amount of filtration. Besides, dialing in the minus two stops might correct this blue shift -- who knows? At any rate, after development, if the images needed color correction, I would handle that in post. Easiest that way.

You know, I just had a thought, sort of a caveat. If you're going to be shooting bright subjects -- sale pale colors on a brightly lit sunny day -- you might want to dial back the -2 stops a bit. Otherwise you might be facing burn through in the bright areas. Then again, maybe not. But sometimes it's better to be safe than sorry.
05-17-2015, 08:21 PM   #11213
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QuoteOriginally posted by cooltouch Quote
Given that print film doesn't mind being over exposed a bit and can often handle as much as two stops overexposure, and also given what can be done to white balance in today's PP software, if this were my film, I would shoot it at two stops under and not bother with any filters. I mean, if you wanted to try to correct using filters, which would you use, and how would you know it's the right amount of filtration. Besides, dialing in the minus two stops might correct this blue shift -- who knows? At any rate, after development, if the images needed color correction, I would handle that in post. Easiest that way.

You know, I just had a thought, sort of a caveat. If you're going to be shooting bright subjects -- sale pale colors on a brightly lit sunny day -- you might want to dial back the -2 stops a bit. Otherwise you might be facing burn through in the bright areas. Then again, maybe not. But sometimes it's better to be safe than sorry.

You mean +2?

05-17-2015, 08:26 PM   #11214
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Yeah, you got it. You must have posted that while I was typing the remainder of this note:

Uh oh, just to be sure that there's no misunderstanding, and because I often get confused between + and - in this type of situation -- two stops minus EV means that it's a push, that is, the image willl be underexposed by two stops. Two stops plus EV is just the opposite, a pull, meaning overexposure by two stops. Of course, what I was getting at above, was overexposure by two stops. And when I wrote "two stops under" I meant two stops of lesser ISO value. EG, box value of ISO 400 reduced to ISO 100. But I really shouldn't have written "the minus two stops" because that sounds too similar to what's actually done when dialing in exposure correction on a camera, in which case, would have caused even more underexposure. Not what we want.
05-17-2015, 09:35 PM   #11215
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QuoteOriginally posted by Colorado CJ Quote
I haven't hiked or shot any photos for about a month, so it was good to get back out there again.

Here's one I shot with my large format film camera during a rainy/snowy hike out on the Colorado/Wyoming border.

Shot using my Zone VI 4x5 and Fujinon W 125mm F5.6 lens on Foma 200 at 120 ISO developed in Pyrocat MC for 8.5 minutes.

Lovely image. I really must drag my 5x4 out more often! Cheers, K.
05-18-2015, 09:54 AM - 2 Likes   #11216
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
Thanks for the lesson guys. I'm currently trying out pushing and pulling on two different cameras right now. My 645 has Ilford Delta 100 at 400 and my Canon A-1 has Ilford HP5 400 at 100. Ya can't learn by just reading about it ya know, gotta actually do it.
I think that it's important to differentiate between pushing/pulling and shifting EV.
Pushing and pulling refers adjusting exposure in capture, and then compensating in developing.

I think of pushing and pulling as a "net zero" process. -1 in capture and +1 in developing equals out to a total of 0.

Shifting EV is not a net zero process. If I decide to shoot expired Kodak Gold 200 @iso 100, that is a +1 process. +1 in capture and 0 in developing equals a +1 total.
05-18-2015, 04:11 PM   #11217
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QuoteOriginally posted by Swift1 Quote
I think that it's important to differentiate between pushing/pulling and shifting EV.
Pushing and pulling refers adjusting exposure in capture, and then compensating in developing.

I think of pushing and pulling as a "net zero" process. -1 in capture and +1 in developing equals out to a total of 0.

Shifting EV is not a net zero process. If I decide to shoot expired Kodak Gold 200 @iso 100, that is a +1 process. +1 in capture and 0 in developing equals a +1 total.
That clarifies a lot. Now I know what EF+- botton is for on the 645. Now I just have to learn when to use it.
05-18-2015, 04:26 PM - 1 Like   #11218
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Canon Eos 300
Kodak Portra 160
05-18-2015, 05:18 PM   #11219
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QuoteOriginally posted by UgurUgurlu Quote
Canon Eos 300
Kodak Portra 160
Good one. How did you chase all the passengers away?
05-18-2015, 05:24 PM   #11220
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QuoteOriginally posted by arnold Quote
Good one. How did you chase all the passengers away?
Thanks
It was the last stop at a very late hour.
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