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05-20-2015, 01:34 AM   #11236
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
Tried out Lomography Redscale 100 ISO. Meh. Maybe I'll take it out to the woods next time. The line on the left if from my defective Epson V600 that needs to be sent back.
Redscale film can be overexposed with some margin (+2 or +3 EV), you'll get quite different results, less redish, other tint appearing.
Redscale is basicaly a film where instead of exposing the front of the film, you expose the back of it. It means that you expose layers in different order. The more you overexpose, the more the red will be "burn" (more luminous) and the blue will appear.

---------- Post added 20th May 2015 at 10:47 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
I have been facetious because yesterday for the first time I received a warning from the moderators because it appears I'd been roughing up the digital guys who use post process to sharpen and increase the contrast of their old lenses for then showing up how cool these lenses are,
I think, pretty much everyone knows here that you hate digital for various reason. But from time to time someone tries to convince you otherwise.
And every time, it goes a bit south

It's just like many people like to try to convince Normhead, how "better" FF would be over APS-C

Don't take it for you, it's more against your idea that they stand.

QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
Checked on the negative, the nose of the shark is present but they cropped it out from the scans, I know I SHOULD scan myself so at least I can have a 24:36 image.
Getting a cheap scanner for 24x36 film can be a good experience for you. You hate digital image because they can be manipulated (as far as i understood). You'll see that scanning images so they look like what the print film is, ain't that much as easy as you might think.
Hence, the good experience.

If you can, borrow a film scanner, instead of buying it, in case you hate the process

05-20-2015, 02:14 AM   #11237
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QuoteOriginally posted by Swift1 Quote
Looks great to me.

FWIW, any scan of negative film is post processed.
Yes, I am aware of that but for me scan is just a way to share pics online, and should be faithful to the prints.

Of course I also know that a good photographer can "enhance" the prints with a good enlarger, underexpose or overexpose the film by at least 1 stop without compromising the quality, and I'm fine if the same is done for scans, but the PP level of certain pics has become ludicrous, today's "professionals" are not like in the 70s or 80s when they tried to take the best image possible gauging light, composition, focus etc..but they are just taking 10.000 shots, selecting one of these and then post process in order to get something that looks fake because it becomes synthetic.

QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote

I think, pretty much everyone knows here that you hate digital for various reason. But from time to time someone tries to convince you otherwise.
And every time, it goes a bit south

It's just like many people like to try to convince Normhead, how "better" FF would be over APS-C

Don't take it for you, it's more against your idea that they stand.

Getting a cheap scanner for 24x36 film can be a good experience for you. You hate digital image because they can be manipulated (as far as i understood). You'll see that scanning images so they look like what the print film is, ain't that much as easy as you might think.
Hence, the good experience.

If you can, borrow a film scanner, instead of buying it, in case you hate the process
Well it's not for various reason, for taking a quick shot I use my smartphone and I find very handy for that.

The problem is that the discussion sounded like something that would happen on a guitarist's board with someone convinced to prove his single coil pickup had a "pure" sound with a record in which he processed the sound through noise gates, filters, fancy mics, choruses etc...NOBODY does that in the guitar community because everybody would laugh at him and everybody knows that to judge a pickup you have to use as little equipment as possible: your main guitar, a good amp which gives a nice clean sound (for distorted tone the amp is predominant) and a cable.

That's it.

On my side, I can't and at the moment I would like to learn how to process and print more, I don't say doing fine scans is easy, quite the opposite, but when I see "photographers" that photoshop beautiful women to enhance their appearance I can't avoid thinking in photography something wrong is happening.

Ok, Cartman mode off.


Last edited by Cuthbert; 05-20-2015 at 02:31 AM.
05-20-2015, 04:03 AM - 1 Like   #11238
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QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote
Redscale film can be overexposed with some margin (+2 or +3 EV), you'll get quite different results, less redish, other tint appearing.
Redscale is basicaly a film where instead of exposing the front of the film, you expose the back of it. It means that you expose layers in different order. The more you overexpose, the more the red will be "burn" (more luminous) and the blue will appear.[COLOR="Silver"]
Thanks. With this and after looking at some redscale images in a web search, I think I got a better understanding to compose some nice shots.

---------- Post added 05-20-15 at 06:23 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
Yes, I am aware of that but for me scan is just a way to share pics online, and should be faithful to the prints.

Of course I also know that a good photographer can "enhance" the prints with a good enlarger, underexpose or overexpose the film by at least 1 stop without compromising the quality, and I'm fine if the same is done for scans, but the PP level of certain pics has become ludicrous, today's "professionals" are not like in the 70s or 80s when they tried to take the best image possible gauging light, composition, focus etc..but they are just taking 10.000 shots, selecting one of these and then post process in order to get something that looks fake because it becomes synthetic.
I consider scanning to be digital photography, where my scanner is a giant sensor that sits on my desk. Similar to darkroom photography is just a different variety of apple in terms of analog. I'm with you and prefer to try and capture the best image possible when shooting, that's when I learn the most and have the most fun. I like post for those happy accidents and anomalies that seem to be absent from my digital photos. I mainly use my DSLR like a polaroid to check exposure before I use film.
05-20-2015, 05:08 AM - 1 Like   #11239
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
Thanks. With this and after looking at some redscale images in a web search, I think I got a better understanding to compose some nice shots.
On the right of the page, there is a picture that show 7 exposure value. The more you expose, the more yellow it gets, and the less red.

Redscale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My testing with "redscaling" kodak gold is that the sunny days, with blue sky, and harsh shadows gives very good results. Overcast gives a very flatter look, with too few contrast.

05-20-2015, 05:29 AM   #11240
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QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote
On the right of the page, there is a picture that show 7 exposure value. The more you expose, the more yellow it gets, and the less red.

Redscale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

My testing with "redscaling" kodak gold is that the sunny days, with blue sky, and harsh shadows gives very good results. Overcast gives a very flatter look, with too few contrast.
Thanks!
05-20-2015, 09:56 AM - 8 Likes   #11241
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Hello people,
first time for me to ever post a photograph on these forums and I am not even sure if I will leave it in for a longer time. I hope you enjoy it while it's there.
I just wanted to say that I have been lurking this thread for some time now and I have to say that I think this is the place to find the greatest images on here. The creativity, enthusiasm and technical knowledge that one can find in this special thread here really inspires me.

I thought this picture here, while technically not perfect, could serve as a gesture to say thanks to all of you. It was taken in an abandoned hospital complex. I was just figuring out perspectives on the staircase when my friend passed by and I took a quick shot. Out of the many pictures taken there, this was the only noteworthy one to me, as it seems to tell some kind of story, and thus, I want to present it to you.

Pentax MZ-5, Zenitar 16mm f2.8, Lomo 800, Epson V500
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05-20-2015, 10:39 AM - 1 Like   #11242
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QuoteOriginally posted by Arvid Quote
Hello people,
first time for me to ever post a photograph on these forums and I am not even sure if I will leave it in for a longer time. I hope you enjoy it while it's there.
I just wanted to say that I have been lurking this thread for some time now and I have to say that I think this is the place to find the greatest images on here. The creativity, enthusiasm and technical knowledge that one can find in this special thread here really inspires me.

I thought this picture here, while technically not perfect, could serve as a gesture to say thanks to all of you. It was taken in an abandoned hospital complex. I was just figuring out perspectives on the staircase when my friend passed by and I took a quick shot. Out of the many pictures taken there, this was the only noteworthy one to me, as it seems to tell some kind of story, and thus, I want to present it to you.

Pentax MZ-5, Zenitar 16mm f2.8, Lomo 800, Epson V500
Welcome, and very cool photo!

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 10:40 AM ----------



Contax G2
Carl Zeiss Planar T* 35/2
Kodak Portra 400
Epson V500
05-20-2015, 10:54 AM   #11243
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QuoteOriginally posted by Swift1 Quote
Welcome, and very cool photo!

---------- Post added 05-20-2015 at 10:40 AM ----------



Contax G2
Carl Zeiss Planar T* 35/2
Kodak Portra 400
Epson V500
So much detail. I love those clouds, the trees are super contrasty(that's my new word). I love the people in the foreground doing the cliche thing that everyone wants to do, even me. The couple a little further on taking a selfie, a little piece of intimacy.

05-20-2015, 01:02 PM   #11244
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QuoteOriginally posted by _Ben Quote
So much detail. I love those clouds, the trees are super contrasty(that's my new word). I love the people in the foreground doing the cliche thing that everyone wants to do, even me. The couple a little further on taking a selfie, a little piece of intimacy.
Thanks, Ben.
05-20-2015, 01:30 PM   #11245
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QuoteOriginally posted by Arvid Quote
Hello people,
first time for me to ever post a photograph on these forums and I am not even sure if I will leave it in for a longer time. I hope you enjoy it while it's there.
I just wanted to say that I have been lurking this thread for some time now and I have to say that I think this is the place to find the greatest images on here. The creativity, enthusiasm and technical knowledge that one can find in this special thread here really inspires me.

I thought this picture here, while technically not perfect, could serve as a gesture to say thanks to all of you. It was taken in an abandoned hospital complex. I was just figuring out perspectives on the staircase when my friend passed by and I took a quick shot. Out of the many pictures taken there, this was the only noteworthy one to me, as it seems to tell some kind of story, and thus, I want to present it to you.

Pentax MZ-5, Zenitar 16mm f2.8, Lomo 800, Epson V500
Nice abstraction. I agree that the person, really almost silhouette, makes this one. Good photograph.
05-20-2015, 02:15 PM - 2 Likes   #11246
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
I have been facetious because yesterday for the first time I received a warning from the moderators because it appears I'd been roughing up the digital guys who use post process to sharpen and increase the contrast of their old lenses for then showing up how cool these lenses are, It told them that IMO the sharpness and constrast of a lens should be judged on film and posted two pics of mine with the same lens, then one of these guys said my pics were crap because they were flat, boring, lacked contrast, sharpness, bla bla...all because they were taken with an overcast sky (like these ones) so as you know the light is different in comparison to a full sunny day.

Then I told him that thread was so filled with digital stuff that Michael Bay would have been proud of them and I assume they got offended...but please I've enough of the CGI crapfest we see on the cinema, digital photography is the still version of that IMO.
You were't winding me up per se - it's just that your understanding of how an image on a negative gets to be a digital image on your screen is fundamentally wrong.

Anyway, here's a scanned and post-processed film shot (that you'll probably criticise because I didn't print it on an enlarger and send the physical print to you):



67ii
105/2.4 wide-open
1/500th
Fuji Pro 400H
Epson 4870 scan
05-20-2015, 03:59 PM - 2 Likes   #11247
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Southern Arizona in Spring-- Pentax 67-- Velvia 50 old version, 55-100 zoom
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05-20-2015, 04:13 PM   #11248
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QuoteOriginally posted by rob1234 Quote
You were't winding me up per se - it's just that your understanding of how an image on a negative gets to be a digital image on your screen is fundamentally wrong.

Anyway, here's a scanned and post-processed film shot (that you'll probably criticise because I didn't print it on an enlarger and send the physical print to you):



67ii
105/2.4 wide-open
1/500th
Fuji Pro 400H
Epson 4870 scan
Nice capture! One can't compose in post. Not that I know of any way. I see restraint here. I can understand how some seem to take it just a little to far.
05-20-2015, 04:23 PM   #11249
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QuoteOriginally posted by rob1234 Quote
You were't winding me up per se - it's just that your understanding of how an image on a negative gets to be a digital image on your screen is fundamentally wrong.
No, YOU don't understand the simple fact you can't judge the sharpness of a lens from a post processed image. Or any other optical qualities for the simple reason you are adding other parameters that modify (enhances?) the quality of the glass.

For the process of going from negative to digital, as said before IMO it should be as transparent as possible especially if you want to appreciate the other factors: light, lens, exposure (from the camera), film. From an engineering perspective if we have to define what is called "transfer faction" its value should be as equal to 1 as possible, it's the same principle of the calibration of the sensors used on a telemetry, you add digital things to the signal, but you want them less invasive as possible.

However talking about the M50 mm f1.4 if we want to judge its sharpness in the centre, bokeh and contrast wide open these UNprocessed pictures don't lie:





If we want to judge its behaviour stepped down to get as much DOF as possible perhaps this picture (Coltonpicture?) might be of help:



QuoteOriginally posted by Arvid Quote
Hello people,
first time for me to ever post a photograph on these forums and I am not even sure if I will leave it in for a longer time. I hope you enjoy it while it's there.
I just wanted to say that I have been lurking this thread for some time now and I have to say that I think this is the place to find the greatest images on here. The creativity, enthusiasm and technical knowledge that one can find in this special thread here really inspires me.

I thought this picture here, while technically not perfect, could serve as a gesture to say thanks to all of you. It was taken in an abandoned hospital complex. I was just figuring out perspectives on the staircase when my friend passed by and I took a quick shot. Out of the many pictures taken there, this was the only noteworthy one to me, as it seems to tell some kind of story, and thus, I want to present it to you.

Pentax MZ-5, Zenitar 16mm f2.8, Lomo 800, Epson V500
IMO from an artistic point of view this picture with its large grain, high saturation from a cheap film (Lomo 800), inventive framing and composition is worth much more than all the plastic looking post processed shots we see not on this board but on others.

There's a feel almost "German Expressionism" (cabinet of Dr.Caligari or Der Golem) in it. You need to understand art, not pixel, sharpness functions, photoshop etc...to appreciate something like it.

Last edited by Cuthbert; 05-20-2015 at 04:28 PM.
05-20-2015, 05:07 PM - 2 Likes   #11250
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QuoteOriginally posted by Swift1 Quote
Welcome, and very cool photo!
thank you, Colton! I guess this is the right time to say a special thanks to you. I admire a lot of the photos you have been posting on here. Next thing I want to try is multiple 6x6 frame panoramas. I am dreaming of shooting them on slide film and to present them in some kind of handmade box that is illuminated from the inside. If I ever get it done, it will be partly thanks to your work I've seen on here.

QuoteOriginally posted by Jacquot Quote
Nice abstraction. I agree that the person, really almost silhouette, makes this one. Good photograph.
Thank you a lot. I didn't expect that such a little bit of feedback from a stranger across the internet would really mean that much to me.

QuoteOriginally posted by Cuthbert Quote
IMO from an artistic point of view this picture with its large grain, high saturation from a cheap film (Lomo 800), inventive framing and composition is worth much more than all the plastic looking post processed shots we see not on this board but on others.

There's a feel almost "German Expressionism" (cabinet of Dr.Caligari or Der Golem) in it. You need to understand art, not pixel, sharpness functions, photoshop etc...to appreciate something like it.
Haha, thank you very much, too. That's a nice way of telling me that I really have to learn a bit more about scanning and postprocessing (whoops!) these images
No seriously, I get what you mean and maybe there's some truth in what you're saying. To strengthen that, I have to confirm that this scene was indeed captured by a german in a german hospital that could have originally been built in the 1920s (not sure about the last part). The whole thing happened in 2015, though. Hope you didn't only give me compliments to further get your point across I have to admit that there was some post (or "pre", as I tried to set up my scanner correctly before scanning, rather than trying to fix things in post) processing involved in the representation of that piece of film emulsion you now watch on your screen.
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