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04-08-2010, 01:29 AM   #1
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repairing black K2, advice?

Trying to fix my black K2 body. Electronics works well. I've changed mirror pads and light seals. Initially the shutter frooze on most shots. But I soon discovered that there were a dent on the bottom plate that caught part of the mechanism right above the bottom plate half way through the mechanical cycle. Having fixed that it now only freeze once every 10-20 shots, but mainly the first 1-2 shots when the camera have been idle for a while. This makes me think that it may be something that need lubrication?

Would apprechiate any advice, especially if you have experience of similar faults on this body or the closely related bodies.

Also wondering what grease or oil you use to lubricate old mechanical cameras?

04-08-2010, 06:32 AM   #2
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A little lubrication may help: It's also possible that one of those mechanisms under there has been bent a little such that it rubs somewhere that it shouldn't. I haven't been into a K2, in particular, but I've occasionally had some success looking over some of the longish linkages that you find inside old Canons.

(I can think of one case where something seemed to be caused by the tripod socket's mounting plate having over time backed off from its mounting and was wobbling around, Doubt it happens *too* often, but it's worth a look when you go in there. )
04-08-2010, 12:59 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
A little lubrication may help: It's also possible that one of those mechanisms under there has been bent a little such that it rubs somewhere that it shouldn't. I haven't been into a K2, in particular, but I've occasionally had some success looking over some of the longish linkages that you find inside old Canons.

(I can think of one case where something seemed to be caused by the tripod socket's mounting plate having over time backed off from its mounting and was wobbling around, Doubt it happens *too* often, but it's worth a look when you go in there. )
Thanks Ratmagiclady, I will try lubrication, but hoped someone knew enough about this model to hint me where to put it...and where not to put it. What lubrication have you used? In the past I've tried a fine sewing machine oil, but it might be a bit to thin, doesn't stay put. Probalby some fine grease would be better?

Tripod socket is in place.

I've also thought that some part behind the bottom plate might have changed a bit in shape. There are some long moving metal piece there that may be voulnerable, but it is sitting behind a larger thicker metal plate that I would think would protect it. The dent was not large. But in any case, I would have to meter with the precision of 1/10 of a milimeter, and then I will need to know where to meter.

I've checked the repair handbook for the K2 and found no hints about this problem. It may be of course a separate problem with the shutter, but considering what great improvement I saw first from just removing the dent, I think I'm in the right region of the mechanics. Or am I?
04-08-2010, 07:27 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Douglas_of_Sweden Quote
Thanks Ratmagiclady, I will try lubrication, but hoped someone knew enough about this model to hint me where to put it...and where not to put it. What lubrication have you used? In the past I've tried a fine sewing machine oil, but it might be a bit to thin, doesn't stay put. Probalby some fine grease would be better?

Tripod socket is in place.

I've also thought that some part behind the bottom plate might have changed a bit in shape. There are some long moving metal piece there that may be voulnerable, but it is sitting behind a larger thicker metal plate that I would think would protect it. The dent was not large. But in any case, I would have to meter with the precision of 1/10 of a milimeter, and then I will need to know where to meter.

I've checked the repair handbook for the K2 and found no hints about this problem. It may be of course a separate problem with the shutter, but considering what great improvement I saw first from just removing the dent, I think I'm in the right region of the mechanics. Or am I?

Well, that's OK. Any dents may in fact be a red herring.... ie, not actually related to the problem.

If pieces aren't rubbing together, it doesn't matter how well-lubricated they are in those places anyway.

Here, by the way, is a site someone pointed me at some while back: they have a European outlet here: Micro-Tools Europe (English)


As long as it doesn't get anywhere and has time for any volatiles to evaporate, sewing machine oil should function OK. In a pinch, A little Tri-flo on a bit of rag also does wonders, sometimes, but you don't want that near glass and probably not directly on any brass works: you'll want to let the most of what's in it evaporate and just put on the Teflon. (There are really much better products for this sort of thing, but Tri-Flo's a gal's best friend for some things: just keep the vapors away from any optics or anything, and the solvents away from any grease you want to remain in place: it *will* basically kill those.


A nice and neutral light white grease should also do OK for such clockwork kinds of things, where anything might bind. (Not much or it'll only attract gunk or whatever! )

Anyway, this site should be one with better products than I've ever been accustomed to use, anyway.

If that were an old Canon, (which wouldn't *quite* behave that way, but maybe close. ) the next suspect would involve something that can't be taken apart, so that's as far as I could help.

04-08-2010, 08:43 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
Well, that's OK. Any dents may in fact be a red herring.... ie, not actually related to the problem.

If pieces aren't rubbing together, it doesn't matter how well-lubricated they are in those places anyway.

Here, by the way, is a site someone pointed me at some while back: they have a European outlet here: Micro-Tools Europe (English)


As long as it doesn't get anywhere and has time for any volatiles to evaporate, sewing machine oil should function OK. In a pinch, A little Tri-flo on a bit of rag also does wonders, sometimes, but you don't want that near glass and probably not directly on any brass works: you'll want to let the most of what's in it evaporate and just put on the Teflon. (There are really much better products for this sort of thing, but Tri-Flo's a gal's best friend for some things: just keep the vapors away from any optics or anything, and the solvents away from any grease you want to remain in place: it *will* basically kill those.


A nice and neutral light white grease should also do OK for such clockwork kinds of things, where anything might bind. (Not much or it'll only attract gunk or whatever! )

Anyway, this site should be one with better products than I've ever been accustomed to use, anyway.

If that were an old Canon, (which wouldn't *quite* behave that way, but maybe close. ) the next suspect would involve something that can't be taken apart, so that's as far as I could help.
Thanks for the link, I've seen their american site, but they didn't want to ship chemicals abroad. Didn't knew their were an European branch. Shopping time!
04-09-2010, 02:13 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
A little Tri-flo on a bit of rag also does wonders, sometimes
I used to use Tri-Flo on my chain 20 years ago when I was a bicycle racer. I didn't know they still made the stuff


QuoteQuote:
A nice and neutral light white grease should also do OK for such clockwork kinds of things, where anything might bind. (Not much or it'll only attract gunk or whatever!
This is of course going back 20 years ago again, however I used white grease on my bicycles back then. Although it was great stuff it developed a layer of liquid on hot sunny days.
If it still does that I wouldn't want it inside my camera.

Douglas, If there are any watch, or clock craftsmen or repairmen in your area they'll probably have the perfect lube for your camera.
04-09-2010, 05:25 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by little laker Quote
I used to use Tri-Flo on my chain 20 years ago when I was a bicycle racer. I didn't know they still made the stuff
Come to think of it, I haven't seen any in a while: I wonder if anything in it turned out to be unhealthy or something. Maybe there's something equivalent out there, though.
04-12-2010, 07:50 AM   #8
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Sounds like you're referring to white lithium grease. Works good where you want a thinner lubricant than traditional grease. I'd be careful about using it in a camera. When it gets warm, it seems to get pretty thin and might run where you don't want it.

Amazon.com: WHITE LITHIUM GREASE 8OZ: Sports & Outdoors

I have squeeze tube of the stuff like this and it isn't uncommon for a watery material to come out first. Little Laker's suggestion about going to a clock/watch shop sounds better. Or maybe email Eric H., the go-to repair guy in the US to see what he uses?

04-13-2010, 01:39 AM   #9
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I had the same problem with a ME recently. The cause was a aged rubber part placed on the mirror housing, causing the mirror to stick every other shot. Maybe it could be the same on the KX?
04-17-2010, 02:18 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by pyra_ohms Quote
I had the same problem with a ME recently. The cause was a aged rubber part placed on the mirror housing, causing the mirror to stick every other shot. Maybe it could be the same on the KX?
Mirror foam dampers has already been replaced.
04-17-2010, 02:40 AM   #11
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Cameras these old needed to be cleaned and relube, usually the mirror box mechanisms as they are all mechanical.
04-17-2010, 09:06 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Douglas_of_Sweden Quote
Mirror foam dampers has already been replaced.
That is not what i meant. I will be sending you an e-mail in swedish.
04-22-2010, 09:32 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by pyra_ohms Quote
I had the same problem with a ME recently. The cause was a aged rubber part placed on the mirror housing, causing the mirror to stick every other shot. Maybe it could be the same on the KX?
That was not such a bad thought actually as the ME serie and the K2 has similar shutters (SEIKO metal), while the KM and KX had old style shutters.

But I tried a little of a new machine oil, and now it runs like a clock. Not a faulty fire in severall hundred shots and not despite letting it sit idle fir a day or two. Next step will be to run a test film through it to see how accurate the exposure times are and how good the automatic exposure is. But at least the shutter sounds good in the sense that the shorter exposure times are definitely shorter and the longer are longer according to my ears, if you understand what I mean. But I have a tough deadline at work, so that will probably not happen before the 27th. But I will be back posting. I have a feeling this camera is going to be a favorit. Only thing I miss from the KX and MX are the judas window. Even the iso/exposure compensation mechanism are working now after some cleaning and lubrication.
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