[MRRiley]

At the risk of beginning to sound like a muckraker here is another situation that affects photographers...

City May Seek Permit and Insurance for Many Kinds of Public Photography

Basically they claim they want pros to have a permit and insurance before shooting on public property. Uhhhh, WHY? If it's public property it should be accessable and usable by everyone. I could understand if the permit was needed if there was an expectation of disrupting pedestrian or vehicular traffic or to draw large crowds to the shoot (say a series of nudes in the middle of Times Square... LOL).

Trouble is, the ordinance itself makes no distinction between pro or amateur, commercial or personal photography so will, as a matter of course, be enforced at the discretion of the police.

Of course it sounds like the real windfall is for the insurance agencies. $1,000,000 liability policies are not cheap...

Those of you who live or shoot in NYC may want to pay close attention to this.

[PDL]

Has NYC held public hearings on this ordinance?

I know a couple of photographers based out of the city - that would not be a good place to be if you work for the city. Those people can be mean. That's all the police need to do - have another distraction - or another method of harassment - depending on your point of reference. If all this adding on of rules keeps up - we will not be able to p*op without government permits and insurance.

PDL

[khardur]

wow - that's really something. I would understand about the group thing - but when you can define "group" as your wife and child and yourself holding the camera within those rules it does sound like it opens up a lot of possibilities for abuse.

Crapola.

[VAV]

On a slightly unrelated note, what are the restrictions on photography in NYC? From other threads as well as reading sign-boards etc as far as I know, the following apply:

1 - Photography not allowed in subways
2 - I have seen signs on the walk at battery park (viewing the Statue of Liberty) saying photography is not permitted - not sure if this is strictly implemented

Could members with experience of photographing in NYC add to this list please?

Thanks

[Ivan Glisin]

1 - Photography not allowed in subways

I am not quite sure this is right: here in Toronto the TTC (Toronto Transit Commission) security is interpreting their own ryle exactly the same way: "photography not allowed -- period". However, their own TTC By-Law #1, section 16b (posted at all subway stations, streetcars and buses) clearly states:

No person shall operate for commercial purposes [emphasis added] any camera, video recording device, movie camera, or any similar device upon any vehicle or premises of the Commission without authorization.

So it reads "for commercial purposes". NY subway is likely the same. Advice for TTC photographers: If approached by a security at TTC vehicles or premises just point out that you are not taking photographs for commercial purposes. They will of course stress that ANY photography is prohibited. Then you can say that you remember seeing in TTC by-law word "commercial" and politely offer to go with them and check TTC by-law just to make sure you will not make the same mistake next time. Of course, it will read "for commercial purposes" and you'll be good to go! :-)

The full text is here:
PUBLIC NOTICE

[FotoPete]

ugh annoying. Yea I've been told to stop taking photos once but I was not aware this By-Law #16B states "commercial" as the deciding factor. Thanks for the link Ivan.

I guess as along as you aren't snapping the railroad tracks out the front window, you should be ok. Cuz the flash can interfere with the driver's visibility..(then again, there's sparks and what not)..

Anyhow, I need the TTC to get to the Henrys Outlet Centre. :P

But I agree that the NYC example is very extreme. Its as if they are either taking the homeland security way too seriously or just trying to limit the shots of landmarks to the 'pros'. Its all about the business sometimes, right?

[VAV]

Correction:

I was trying to lookup the MTA rules regarding photography to confirm if photography is indeed not permitted on the subways.

Per the MTA rules, (MTA NYC Transit - Rules of Conduct) photography apparently is allowed. There was a proposal to disallow this in 2005 but the rules ultimately never got changed. Here is the relevant MTA rule:

"Photography, filming or video recording in any facility or conveyance is permitted except that ancillary equipment such as lights, reflectors or tripods may not be used. Members of the press holding valid identification issued by the New York City Police Department are hereby authorized to use necessary ancillary equipment. All photographic activity must be conducted in accordance with the provisions of this Part.

[carpents]

On a slightly unrelated note, what are the restrictions on photography in NYC? From other threads as well as reading sign-boards etc as far as I know, the following apply:

1 - Photography not allowed in subways
2 - I have seen signs on the walk at battery park (viewing the Statue of Liberty) saying photography is not permitted - not sure if this is strictly implemented

Could members with experience of photographing in NYC add to this list please?

Thanks

1. I take photos in the New York subway all the time. No problems.
(I did get yelled to in the Washington DC subway once, but I flipped him off.)
2. Were you on private property? I know there are some parts with the pay-binocular things, and I could understand the vendor not wanting people slugging 600mm f/4 lenses right next to them. But I have been generally unmolested in Battery Park along the whole walk.

I have heard of a restriction on photographing the bridges, but that's all.

[Rico]

The suggested NYC permits are geared more towards two or more people working together in a single location for more than 30 minutes at a time. Such as a photographer with assistant and a model.

[VAV]

1. I take photos in the New York subway all the time. No problems.
(I did get yelled to in the Washington DC subway once, but I flipped him off.)
2. Were you on private property? I know there are some parts with the pay-binocular things, and I could understand the vendor not wanting people slugging 600mm f/4 lenses right next to them. But I have been generally unmolested in Battery Park along the whole walk.

I have heard of a restriction on photographing the bridges, but that's all.

Carpents,

Thanks for the info. I don't remember where near battery place I saw the notices. But looks like they are not relevant now.

[MRRiley]

Per the NYC Film Commisions website...

"MOFTB will continue to accept feedback on the proposed rules until August 3, 2007, and may determine that it is appropriate to revise its proposal."

So it's under review and open for public comment. Perhaps they will actually listen and make the rules less ambiguous and open to interpretation by the police. A vague law is worse than no law at all since you can never be sure how or when it will be enforced.