[Pentaxor]

It would even be better if one could compare shots with the same lens with/without the adapter - but for obvious reasons that's impossible.

Ben

Ben, I had tried doing such test, atleast at short focal distances since infinity focus is impossible for the glassless adapter. what I did was to focus the glassless adapter at infinity which does not really attain infinity but shorter focus then took an image for it, and then I used the adapter w/ a glass element readjusting at a certain focal distance that would atleast mimick the image result taken by the glassless adapter.

it did still show a bit of background magnification, loss of light and larger DOF. although I noticed the color halo effect on certain outlines of the image from letter prints on the sticker to some edges of the object. this is only noticeable when cropped at a certain magnification by which I cant remember by how much.

I would be posting some sample images taken at wide open and will take some images at lower apertures at f5.6 and f8 again since I can't tell which ones were taken at lower apertures.

[Pentaxor]

here is a sample shot taken with the Vivitar 90mm/2.5 + FD/K adapter combo, focused at midrange, wide open (f2.5) .

first two photos is the original image with no post-processing (no sharpening), and no NR done except for resize. 2nd photo is a 100% cropped portion of the image to show detail sharpness on the feathers which are evidently doesn't look that there's too much detail from afar and the glow effect made by the optic glass of the adapter. without the optic glass element, the glow effect is absent, and image appear a bit more sharper, more contrasty, no fringing and CA at the outline of the objects and highlighted areas, but has a much shallow DOF. 3rd photo is a slightly post-processed image w/o NR done.


from my observation, the lens has a pretty impressive resolution and overall IQ that carried the shortcomings of the corrective element. but ultimately, what I really loved about this lens is it's bokeh rendering.

1st photo


2nd photo


3rd photo

[JohnBee]

here is a sample shot taken with the Vivitar 90mm/2.5 + FD/K adapter combo, focused at midrange, wide open (f2.5)

Most impressive indeed...
Is this the macro edition of that lens or something else?

[Pentaxor]

Most impressive indeed...
Is this the macro edition of that lens or something else?

JB, this is the macro VMC S1 edition. honestly speaking, the lens is not only great for macro but for telephoto use as well. it would still work extremely well even with a 1.4x TC, just basing alone from using the FD/K adapter with an inferior corrective glass. I must say this lens has really impressed me alot overall. now, I'm just waiting for a better NX10 successor or NEX-5 successor or any camera mount and glassless adapter that is a 100% compatible with the lens. if I see anyone sell their NX10 for $200, I would get one just for the exclusive use of this lens.

[Kerrowdown]

Douglas, how do you know all this stuff, I'm well impressed with your mount knowledge, but would like to suggest that maybe you might like to take the chance to get out more.

[Douglas_of_Sweden]

Douglas, how do you know all this stuff, I'm well impressed with your mount knowledge, but would like to suggest that maybe you might like to take the chance to get out more.

Thanks for your concern, but I do get out quite a lot. Take a look at my flickr photo stream for instance.

Dad put me in a darkroom when I was six. Got around for a while with a funky cheap 35mm rangefinder, borrowed the Prakticas the camera club had, saved up to my first own SLR system when I was 11 (Konica), sold out and got my first Pentax bodies when I was 15 (that was in 1983 when the Super-A won the big camera prices in both Japan, Europe and the US), learned the Nikon and Hasselblad systems during my military service in the air force, been cheating with a couple of other systems, have a crazy familly that are about as camera obsessed as I am, and dito friends...it all sums up to that I know what to look for, what should be possible, what I saw back in the 80's or 90's, which is a good start when looking at the web. So it didn't took much time to write that list, if you don't count all those background years.

As for motivation...for a starter I've got a 200mm macro 1:1 lens that all in all costed me less than 100 USD including shipping and adapter, a lens that appears to perform very well. It makes it easier to suffer the lack of a A or FA200mm macro in my bag. And going out in the nature and shoot critters are something I enjoy a lot, but some of the more interresting ones never sit still long enough, so I've been looking for more reach in macro. So that lens came as a gift from aloft.

Now I want a Retina 85mm, but people appears to pay relatively crazy prices for them considering that it is an f4. Anyone who have actually used one on a DSLR? Having got that Canon FD 200mm macro that sheap I've somehow got expectations that it would be that easy to grap some more adaptable glass, except for perhaps the Leica R glass. Oh, there is a Topcor 135mm macro that also looks great.

[Douglas_of_Sweden]

Took out the glass of one of my SCOPTIC made FD-K adapters today. Sat down with some lens-spanners, but soon discovered that it only took my fingers. If you want to do this yourself, just grab the black metal around the lens and turn counterclockwise and the glass will unscrew. I haven't taken appart the lens unit itself, but I get the feeling when looking at its edges that it may be a two lens one group solution. Not sure.
Anyway, while it is anoying that they sell the FD to Nikon F adapter with and without glass, and the FD to Pentax K adapter only with glass, it is so simple to take out the glass, and they are so cheap anyway, that it doesn't really matter.

Without the glass, the difference in focal flange distance between FD and K and the extra thickness of the adapter means that this is like using an extension tube of about 10-12 mm (haven't measured the thickness of the adapter). That has little effect on a 200mm macro, but the max macro scale should be slightly larger than 1:1 and the close focus distance should go down somewhat, and there should be a tiny light loss (but less than with the glass in the adapter). I loose infinity focus, but it focus to about 3m, which is enough when chasing bugs, which has been my intention with this lens. And no glass of course means no optical degradation...

No side to side comparison, which I intend to do, but at least an apetizer;











I know the last shot isn't a success since only the right wing is in focus, but that also demonstrates the limitation of this oterhwise nice lens. I have to shoot stopped down, and I can't really close down more than f11 and still have enough light in the viewfinder to focus, but that isn't enough for all motifes.

Anyway, I think this adapter, with or without glass, probably even more so without glass, is an excellent way to get cheap macro glass to your Pentax camera, be it Pentaxors Vivitar 90mm or my Canon 200mm, or any other of the classical Canon or 3rd party 50/90/100/105/135 etc macro lenses in FD mount. As long as you are prepared to learn to work closed down. For stationary subjects where you can work with tripod etc or slow bugs "close - open" ring on the adapter is fast enough. For fast bugs one need to focus closed down, there isn't usually time for anything else. That is a limitation, but you can learn to work with it.

[Pentaxor]

Took out the glass of one of my SCOPTIC made FD-K adapters today. Sat down with some lens-spanners, but soon discovered that it only took my fingers. If you want to do this yourself, just grab the black metal around the lens and turn counterclockwise and the glass will unscrew. I haven't taken appart the lens unit itself, but I get the feeling when looking at its edges that it may be a two lens one group solution. Not sure.
Anyway, while it is anoying that they sell the FD to Nikon F adapter with and without glass, and the FD to Pentax K adapter only with glass, it is so simple to take out the glass, and they are so cheap anyway, that it doesn't really matter.

Without the glass, the difference in focal flange distance between FD and K and the extra thickness of the adapter means that this is like using an extension tube of about 10-12 mm (haven't measured the thickness of the adapter). That has little effect on a 200mm macro, but the max macro scale should be slightly larger than 1:1 and the close focus distance should go down somewhat, and there should be a tiny light loss (but less than with the glass in the adapter). I loose infinity focus, but it focus to about 3m, which is enough when chasing bugs, which has been my intention with this lens. And no glass of course means no optical degradation...

No side to side comparison, which I intend to do, but at least an apetizer;











I know the last shot isn't a success since only the right wing is in focus, but that also demonstrates the limitation of this oterhwise nice lens. I have to shoot stopped down, and I can't really close down more than f11 and still have enough light in the viewfinder to focus, but that isn't enough for all motifes.

Anyway, I think this adapter, with or without glass, probably even more so without glass, is an excellent way to get cheap macro glass to your Pentax camera, be it Pentaxors Vivitar 90mm or my Canon 200mm, or any other of the classical Canon or 3rd party 50/90/100/105/135 etc macro lenses in FD mount. As long as you are prepared to learn to work closed down. For stationary subjects where you can work with tripod etc or slow bugs "close - open" ring on the adapter is fast enough. For fast bugs one need to focus closed down, there isn't usually time for anything else. That is a limitation, but you can learn to work with it.

Yes, Douglas. it is definitely very workable for macro purpose of a macro lens. the limitations is more like a pros and cons thing with regards to having a glassless adapter versus glass adapter.

if I were to say it in simple terms, it would be:

glassless adapter: great macro, shallow DOF, max (wide) aperture usage, more light at the expense of losing infinity

glass adapter: great macro at stop down (f8 and over), thicker DOF, infinity focus, increased focal length magnification by 1.34x equivalent to a 125mm lens (for a 90mm lens) at the expense of a stop over loss of light, CA, presence of small bokeh circles that are common with longer focal length lenses (due to magnification).

although I have to say that I would had loved to use the 90mm as a 90mm telephoto. I had been considering either an NX or NEX mount or wishfully thinking a micro FF mount camera to serve such purpose. I guess it wont be that far-off since Pentax have some collaboration with either Samsung and Sony.

[Douglas_of_Sweden]

Yes, Douglas. it is definitely very workable for macro purpose of a macro lens. the limitations is more like a pros and cons thing with regards to having a glassless adapter versus glass adapter.

And now I have both

[Douglas_of_Sweden]

Got myself a new adapter for the Retina/Voigtländer bayonette mount to m42 (1.1p in the table in the beginning of the thread). Picked the m42 ahead of the K version in case I want to use these lenses on any of my m42 bodies.

This is what it looks like:

The small screw in the slot in the top of the photo is important because that is the one that is to catch the aperture level on the lens.


m42 side

Then you need a lens like this (like the Retina-Tele-Xenar f:4/135mm Schneider-Kreuznach)


As you can see, it does not have an aperture ring, it used to be a part of the cameras that these lenses were made for.


The slot in the bottom part of the bayonette locks the lens onto the camera (or the adapter, you can see the small pin that lock the adapter on the lens on the m42 side of the adapter). There are two pins, one on each side (you can see one of them at almost 6 o'clock, just below the lock slot), that work as aperture levels (why two?). The screw in the slot on the inside of the adapter catch one of the aperture pins on the lens.

Lens+adapter = lens with aperture ring:

...and m42 mount.

Look at the cute focal depth markers (red pins) that move when you change apperture. Like on Hasselblad lenses.

The aperture ring surpriced me a bit and first I thought it was broken. If you turn it to a larger aperture opening than the maximum on the current lens it will suddenly close down again to the minima opening and then you have to turn it all the way back to the smallest aperture opening to catch the pin again and to be able to open up again.

I will be posting more picture in the 135mm lens club, but here are some samples:

at f8


at f4

It goes quite soft wide open. But it is sort of a nice softness. Maybe usefull for portraits. A drawback is the long close focus distance of 4m. Build quality is excellent.

Now, the other interresting lenses are probably first of all the 50mm f1.9 and the 85mm f4. The few wider and longer options does not interrest me that much. But that 85mm goes for relatively much despite of being only f4.

[Douglas_of_Sweden]

There has been some additions to the adapters lately. Leitax has started to make a replacement mount to turn olympus OM zuiko lenses into K mount, and I've seen a Minolta to K mount adapter (sort of similar to the Candon FD and Nikon F to K mount adaptors with an optical element in). Will update the table soon. Has anyone tried these out yet? There are some nice zuiko glass out there, some macro lenses for instance.

I've also got hold of a 85mm in Retina Kodak mount that I hope to test during the holidays and post some examples with. Small and slow. Size like the DA70ltd. Will be hard to find a shade.

[Pentaxor]

There has been some additions to the adapters lately. Leitax has started to make a replacement mount to turn olympus OM zuiko lenses into K mount, and I've seen a Minolta to K mount adapter (sort of similar to the Candon FD and Nikon F to K mount adaptors with an optical element in). Will update the table soon. Has anyone tried these out yet? There are some nice zuiko glass out there, some macro lenses for instance.

I've also got hold of a 85mm in Retina Kodak mount that I hope to test during the holidays and post some examples with. Small and slow. Size like the DA70ltd. Will be hard to find a shade.

I wish there was no optical element involved. but if the optical element doesn't significantly degrade the IQ, something like the Tamron SP TC, then I think that would be ok.

[excanonfd]

Douglas,

This is based on my own observations playing with the DKL mount and Voigtlander Color Skopar 50/2.8 (first) then Retina Xenar 50/2.8 and Retina Curtagon 35/2.8. If you look closely at the aperture lever on the lens (135/4.0), it's bent inwards a bit. Take a small screw driver or a penknife and straighten it out and the problem of the adapter shooting past the maximum aperture of the lens will largely disappear. When mounting or dismounting the lens from the adapter, do so with the adapter at f22 just to make sure the aperture actuating screw on the adapter is on the correct side of the aperture lever on the lens at all times.

I am waiting for the 135/4.0 to arrive and eying the 28/4.0, 50/1.9 and the 85/4.0, all Schneider-Kreuznach. For some unknown reason (imo), Rodenstock Retina lenses are prohibitively expensive. I also have a couple of bodies from which I hope to remove the mount and convert it to DKL to PK adapter using either 3rd party Tamron PK mount or the generic PK extension tubes. Should make for an interesting project in the cold nights ahead.

Thanks,

[kryss]

There has been some additions to the adapters lately. Leitax has started to make a replacement mount to turn olympus OM zuiko lenses into K mount, and I've seen a Minolta to K mount adapter (sort of similar to the Candon FD and Nikon F to K mount adaptors with an optical element in). Will update the table soon. Has anyone tried these out yet? There are some nice zuiko glass out there, some macro lenses for instance.

I've also got hold of a 85mm in Retina Kodak mount that I hope to test during the holidays and post some examples with. Small and slow. Size like the DA70ltd. Will be hard to find a shade.

Hi Douglas,received my FD-PK adapter(with glass) today,Mfg by Success Optics(scoptic) I tried it on following Fd lenses with great success. 28mm f2, 50mmf1.4,28-50mm f3.5 SSC,85mm f1.8.300mm f5.6 and a Sigma 600mm f8.I even put a Canon 2x extender in between. Didn't work too well on 28mm but rest were fine and focussed to infinity.As most of my work is Macro I also tried the adapter without glass and was very impressed.Shot in RAW and tweaked in LR3 adobe raw converter +CS5 & full suite of Nik software and I was very happy. Doesn,t bother me that I get minor focal length extension and loss of light, compared to being able to use my expensive FD lenses. Regards.Chris.

[Lowell Goudge]

Douglas

This really should be Condensed into an article