K-5 and X-synx

RonHendriks1966 · 11-25-2010, 04:53 PM

I only have a Metz AF-58 flash. This is somehow limited in function with the hotshoe. This was also with the K-7

So on the hotshoe on X-sync:

Continous Low gives 1,4 fps and this is like the book.

Continous Hi gives 2,9 fps and this is the same as with the K-7. There is some limitation in communication. A Pentax flash should work normally with more fps.

With the K-7 I could make 5,2 fps with flash connecting my Metz either true a trigger on the hotshoe or true cable and the X-sync port.

My K-5 does not do that!
- Set to AF-C (lower framerate) it fires the flash everytime.
- Set to AF-S and continous Low it fires the flash everytime at 1,4 fps.
- Set to AF-S and continous Hi it fires the flash only for the first shot of the burst (the same for connected to trigger or cable)

Can someone try this with a Pentax flash or is this just a bug?

Wheatfield · 11-25-2010, 05:59 PM

Can someone explain the above post?

nanok · 11-25-2010, 06:10 PM

is the flash configured such that it still has "juice" after the first shot? (so it doesn't have to re-charge; if you have it on full blast, after the first shot it will be "dead")

wheatfield: no.

RonHendriks1966 · 11-26-2010, 07:16 AM

I set the flash to alower blast 1/128th of the power, so the flash can ceep shooting for a several hundreds of shots. The X-sync just doesn't give a signal to fire to the flash.

RonHendriks1966 · 11-26-2010, 07:18 AM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

Can someone explain the above post?

Wel the question is: do you have a K-5 and do you have a Pentax flash like the 540? If so can you put them together and use them at Hi-continous shooting with 7 fps and still get the flash working at every shot?

Wheatfield · 11-26-2010, 06:32 PM

I was able to fire my Metz 60 CT-2 15 times repeatably, then the flash missed on actuation, then fired another dozen or so times and missed one again.
For me this is no biggie, I'll never use my equipment this way in real life.

Is this a big deal for you or are you just trying to find problems?

Ole · 11-26-2010, 07:52 PM

I got the following with the AF360:

Exposure mode: X
AF.S
Shooting mode continuous high
Flash in manual, 1/32 power (as low as it will go)
Flash mounted in hot shoe
RAW (DNG)
Indoors, EV 5

Result: Flash fires every time, but the frame rate is not more than about 3 frames per second.

Same result no matter how CF20 (allow flash while charging) was set.

If I turn the flash off but remain in X mode, the frame rate is at top speed.

Last edited by Ole; 11-26-2010 at 08:08 PM.

Wheatfield · 11-26-2010, 08:06 PM

It shouldn't matter in this instance. The shutter trips, but the flash doesn't fire. Set that to 2 and the shutter wouldn't trip if the flash wasn't ready. I was firing the Metz off the PC socket, so the camera has no way of knowing if the flash is ready (it doesn't know there is a flash for that matter). The ready light was staying lit on the Metz, though at 15 shots very quickly, it wouldn't surprise me if the capacitor was down, though I would think it would misfire more than just once and then give another burst before quitting again were this the case.

**Digitalis** · 11-27-2010, 01:36 AM

Originally posted by RonHendriks1966

The X-sync just doesn't give a signal to fire to the flash.

I had a problem with flash communication with an early K7 my AF160FC ringflash was firing intermittently. However updating the firmware resolved the issue...I recommend you do the same. but you could have stumbled on a hardware incompatibility.

My AF540FGZ can keep up with a nikon D3s at 9FPS at 1/16th power.

RonHendriks1966 · 11-27-2010, 01:25 PM

mmmmmmmm I will see a Pentax representant at ZoomExperience - Home tomorrow and ask him.

So you al think it should work normally. And mine isn't.

Wheatfield · 11-27-2010, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by RonHendriks1966

mmmmmmmm I will see a Pentax representant at ZoomExperience - Home tomorrow and ask him.

So you al think it should work normally. And mine isn't.

I guess you have me on ignore. I suppose I can hardly blame you for that.

**Digitalis** · 11-27-2010, 06:41 PM

So he's off to see a pentax representative about a 3rd party piece of hardware, can someone pass the popcorn?

RonHendriks1966 · 11-28-2010, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

So he's off to see a pentax representative about a 3rd party piece of hardware, can someone pass the popcorn?

Well not totaly only, but he also had the AF540FGZ with him. It works on hotshoe, but limited speed, I think the before mentionted 2.8-2.9 fps. No trigger with me and non on the stand so no test of it with cable.

Originally posted by Wheatfield

I guess you have me on ignore. I suppose I can hardly blame you for that.

No I haven't

Originally posted by Digitalis

I recommend you do the same. but you could have stumbled on a hardware incompatibility.

My AF540FGZ can keep up with a nikon D3s at 9FPS at 1/16th power.

That is the question, since my metz could work on the K-7 with 5,2 fps so the 7 shouldn't be a problem.

Originally posted by Wheatfield

It shouldn't matter in this instance. The shutter trips, but the flash doesn't fire. Set that to 2 and the shutter wouldn't trip if the flash wasn't ready. I was firing the Metz off the PC socket, so the camera has no way of knowing if the flash is ready (it doesn't know there is a flash for that matter). The ready light was staying lit on the Metz, though at 15 shots very quickly, it wouldn't surprise me if the capacitor was down, though I would think it would misfire more than just once and then give another burst before quitting again were this the case.

I'm still a little confused. English is for me my third language, so I understand a lot, but I don't understand everything in your post. Are you referring to the setting in the menu, for firering the internal flash, waiting for flash ready or fire anyway? This has nothing to do with the hotshoe/external flash.

Did your camera work giving 7 fps and firing the Metz everytime?????

In that case I think it would be a problem of my K-5.

Wheatfield · 11-28-2010, 07:13 PM

Originally posted by RonHendriks1966

I'm still a little confused. English is for me my third language, so I understand a lot, but I don't understand everything in your post. Are you referring to the setting in the menu, for firering the internal flash, waiting for flash ready or fire anyway? This has nothing to do with the hotshoe/external flash.

Did your camera work giving 7 fps and firing the Metz everytime?????

In that case I think it would be a problem of my K-5.

I was explaining to Ole why that setting would not affect what we were discussing.
Anyway, my K5 fired the flash 15 times in a row, missed once and then fired another dozen or so before missing another one, and by then the buffer was full.
So, if you have a problem with your camera, I would seem to have the same one.
Since I will never use my equipment this way, it's not something I'm going to concern myself with.

gerard7452 · 11-29-2010, 05:21 AM

Hi Ron,

problem definately is in the Firmware and must be a bug in the PTTL protocol. I have a TUMAX flash that does not work at all on K5(latest FW) either. It does flash the first time and than starts "strobing" until the batteries are flat :-) Only way it works if flashpower is set to manual (1/1) .. TUMAX works fine with K10, K20 and K7.
A faulty protocol over the socket (but also the internal flash) consumes time and brings your fps down to what you see i guess. Hoping for new firmare soon .. groeten.

11-25-2010, 04:53 PM	#1
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	K-5 and X-synx I only have a Metz AF-58 flash. This is somehow limited in function with the hotshoe. This was also with the K-7 So on the hotshoe on X-sync: Continous Low gives 1,4 fps and this is like the book. Continous Hi gives 2,9 fps and this is the same as with the K-7. There is some limitation in communication. A Pentax flash should work normally with more fps. With the K-7 I could make 5,2 fps with flash connecting my Metz either true a trigger on the hotshoe or true cable and the X-sync port. My K-5 does not do that! - Set to AF-C (lower framerate) it fires the flash everytime. - Set to AF-S and continous Low it fires the flash everytime at 1,4 fps. - Set to AF-S and continous Hi it fires the flash only for the first shot of the burst (the same for connected to trigger or cable) Can someone try this with a Pentax flash or is this just a bug?

11-25-2010, 05:59 PM	#2
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Can someone explain the above post?

11-25-2010, 06:10 PM	#3
nanok Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 969	is the flash configured such that it still has "juice" after the first shot? (so it doesn't have to re-charge; if you have it on full blast, after the first shot it will be "dead") wheatfield: no.

11-26-2010, 07:16 AM	#4
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675 Original Poster	I set the flash to alower blast 1/128th of the power, so the flash can ceep shooting for a several hundreds of shots. The X-sync just doesn't give a signal to fire to the flash.

11-26-2010, 07:18 AM	#5
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675 Original Poster	Originally posted by Wheatfield Can someone explain the above post? Wel the question is: do you have a K-5 and do you have a Pentax flash like the 540? If so can you put them together and use them at Hi-continous shooting with 7 fps and still get the flash working at every shot?

11-26-2010, 06:32 PM	#6
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	I was able to fire my Metz 60 CT-2 15 times repeatably, then the flash missed on actuation, then fired another dozen or so times and missed one again. For me this is no biggie, I'll never use my equipment this way in real life. Is this a big deal for you or are you just trying to find problems?

11-26-2010, 07:52 PM	#7
Ole Administrator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,408	I got the following with the AF360: Exposure mode: X AF.S Shooting mode continuous high Flash in manual, 1/32 power (as low as it will go) Flash mounted in hot shoe RAW (DNG) Indoors, EV 5 Result: Flash fires every time, but the frame rate is not more than about 3 frames per second. Same result no matter how CF20 (allow flash while charging) was set. If I turn the flash off but remain in X mode, the frame rate is at top speed. Last edited by Ole; 11-26-2010 at 08:08 PM.

11-26-2010, 08:06 PM	#8
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	It shouldn't matter in this instance. The shutter trips, but the flash doesn't fire. Set that to 2 and the shutter wouldn't trip if the flash wasn't ready. I was firing the Metz off the PC socket, so the camera has no way of knowing if the flash is ready (it doesn't know there is a flash for that matter). The ready light was staying lit on the Metz, though at 15 shots very quickly, it wouldn't surprise me if the capacitor was down, though I would think it would misfire more than just once and then give another burst before quitting again were this the case.

11-27-2010, 01:36 AM	#9
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by RonHendriks1966 The X-sync just doesn't give a signal to fire to the flash. I had a problem with flash communication with an early K7 my AF160FC ringflash was firing intermittently. However updating the firmware resolved the issue...I recommend you do the same. but you could have stumbled on a hardware incompatibility. My AF540FGZ can keep up with a nikon D3s at 9FPS at 1/16th power.

11-27-2010, 01:25 PM	#10
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675 Original Poster	mmmmmmmm I will see a Pentax representant at ZoomExperience - Home tomorrow and ask him. So you al think it should work normally. And mine isn't.

11-27-2010, 06:16 PM	#11
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by RonHendriks1966 mmmmmmmm I will see a Pentax representant at ZoomExperience - Home tomorrow and ask him. So you al think it should work normally. And mine isn't. I guess you have me on ignore. I suppose I can hardly blame you for that.

11-27-2010, 06:41 PM	#12
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	So he's off to see a pentax representative about a 3rd party piece of hardware, can someone pass the popcorn?

11-28-2010, 11:35 AM	#13
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675 Original Poster	Originally posted by Digitalis So he's off to see a pentax representative about a 3rd party piece of hardware, can someone pass the popcorn? Well not totaly only, but he also had the AF540FGZ with him. It works on hotshoe, but limited speed, I think the before mentionted 2.8-2.9 fps. No trigger with me and non on the stand so no test of it with cable. Originally posted by Wheatfield I guess you have me on ignore. I suppose I can hardly blame you for that. No I haven't Originally posted by Digitalis I recommend you do the same. but you could have stumbled on a hardware incompatibility. My AF540FGZ can keep up with a nikon D3s at 9FPS at 1/16th power. That is the question, since my metz could work on the K-7 with 5,2 fps so the 7 shouldn't be a problem. Originally posted by Wheatfield It shouldn't matter in this instance. The shutter trips, but the flash doesn't fire. Set that to 2 and the shutter wouldn't trip if the flash wasn't ready. I was firing the Metz off the PC socket, so the camera has no way of knowing if the flash is ready (it doesn't know there is a flash for that matter). The ready light was staying lit on the Metz, though at 15 shots very quickly, it wouldn't surprise me if the capacitor was down, though I would think it would misfire more than just once and then give another burst before quitting again were this the case. I'm still a little confused. English is for me my third language, so I understand a lot, but I don't understand everything in your post. Are you referring to the setting in the menu, for firering the internal flash, waiting for flash ready or fire anyway? This has nothing to do with the hotshoe/external flash. Did your camera work giving 7 fps and firing the Metz everytime????? In that case I think it would be a problem of my K-5.

11-28-2010, 07:13 PM	#14
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by RonHendriks1966 I'm still a little confused. English is for me my third language, so I understand a lot, but I don't understand everything in your post. Are you referring to the setting in the menu, for firering the internal flash, waiting for flash ready or fire anyway? This has nothing to do with the hotshoe/external flash. Did your camera work giving 7 fps and firing the Metz everytime????? In that case I think it would be a problem of my K-5. I was explaining to Ole why that setting would not affect what we were discussing. Anyway, my K5 fired the flash 15 times in a row, missed once and then fired another dozen or so before missing another one, and by then the buffer was full. So, if you have a problem with your camera, I would seem to have the same one. Since I will never use my equipment this way, it's not something I'm going to concern myself with.

11-29-2010, 05:21 AM	#15
gerard7452 New Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Wassenaar Posts: 8	Hi Ron, problem definately is in the Firmware and must be a bug in the PTTL protocol. I have a TUMAX flash that does not work at all on K5(latest FW) either. It does flash the first time and than starts "strobing" until the batteries are flat :-) Only way it works if flashpower is set to manual (1/1) .. TUMAX works fine with K10, K20 and K7. A faulty protocol over the socket (but also the internal flash) consumes time and brings your fps down to what you see i guess. Hoping for new firmare soon .. groeten.