Forum: Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Other Camera Brands
05-29-2022, 02:46 AM
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For information, the reason I switched from Pentax is:
Since 2010 I have desperately wanted to stop having to rely on a mirror in my cameras!
I hate all the implications of having a mirror flipping up and down while I'm shooting.
Especially in burst-mode, which applies to all my action photographs.
I kept hoping Pentax would provide top-end mirrorless equipment with adapters for K-Mount lenses.
Had Pentax done so I would still be a Pentax user and I would saved a LOT of money.
(I used Pentax SLRs and dSLRs from 1967 to 2020).
But Pentax repeatedly emphasised this wouldn't happen.:mad:
I'm 75; I couldn't wait any longer!
My personal reasons don't apply to many Pentax users; the K-1-series & K-3-series cameras are just right for many people.
Edit:
Here is an article about why I wanted "mirrorless" that I published on my website in 2010: Musings on Micro Four Thirds |
Forum: Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Other Camera Brands
05-29-2022, 01:08 AM
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My last Pentax camera was the K-3ii. That had good very build quality and I assume the K-3iii is even better.
My R5 has very good build quality. I suspect the R7 won't be as good. It is based on magnesium alloy.
Ditto for weather sealing. The R5 has very good weather sealing, but Canon have said the R7's weather sealing isn't as good.
Only 2 RF-S lenses have been announced. EF-S lenses for Canon APSC dSLRs can be used via the cheap simple adapter.
I assume you are correct about pixel-shift and astro-tracing. I don't recall seeing anything about those in the R7.
I'm not here to sell the R7!
I wouldn't have started a thread here about it. I just belatedly added to an existing thread.
I got a lot of my knowledge about the R7 from this 82 minute video, which I've watched twice.
It was live-streamed and answers a lot of viewer's questions. You Tube |
src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/jnh5gAcdVNk?controls=1" allowfullscreen> |
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Forum: Pentax News and Rumors
02-22-2021, 07:18 AM
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The Canon R5 wasn't teased for a year or more.
(I didn't even know Canon did mirrorless cameras until June 2020!)
The Pentax "flagship APSC camera" was first teased in September 2019: First Look: This is the Upcoming Pentax APS-C Flagship DSLR
But note the real point I was making:
It is pointless comparing what is happening to Canon's development & delivery with that of Pentax.
Ditto for Sony & Nikon & others versus Pentax.
That is why I specifically responded to
"Canon is reportedly delaying a planned camera release for similar supply issues (also intended for reveal at CP+)."
When companies habitually release a number of cameras a year, it isn't very serious if a pandemic (or whatever) cuts back releases.
They have a recent catalogue, (I think about 20+ Canon cameras since the K-1ii, mostly minor, some major).
I believe Canon were planning a number of RF cameras in 2021, and that may be cut back to perhaps 2 or 3; we'll know soon.
And I still see new cameras being launched (& reviewed) from Sony, FujiFilm, Nikon, etc.
When a company has a glacially slow release of cameras, they are vulnerable in the marketplace.
Any hold-up is very serious.
My opinion, which perhaps all Pentaxians here will disagree with, is that the new camera should have been envisaged to be fast to release.
Instead, it appears to have an over-ambitious slow-to-develop camera aimed at a disappearing market.
Did Ricoh mis-read the speed with which the market-place is changing?
Let's hope that Ricoh/Pentax can restore credibility at CP+, including news about a new FF camera.
Without the latter, what will be the point of Pentax after the K3iii?
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Forum: Pentax News and Rumors
02-21-2021, 01:06 PM
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After 50 years as a dedicated Pentax user, I switched from Pentax to Canon-RF in July 2020, just after I heard about them.
I ordered lots of stuff.
I was hopping mad that my pre-ordered R5 took MONTHS to arrive.
So did my 100-500mm lens.
And my 1.4x and 2x extenders,
But I had them all well before the end of 2020.
I'm still waiting for a battery grip for my R5.
(My R battery grip came quickly)
And I'm waiting for a lens-hood for one of my 8 RF lenses.
(Most of my 8 Canon RF lenses arrived quickly. As did a 3rd-party TTArtisans RF FishEye lens).
This is how I see current problems with Canon supply. It can sometimes take MONTHS for products to arrive.
But not YEARS!
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Forum: Pentax K-1 & K-1 II
11-25-2018, 05:26 AM
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I would welcome that, and I would pre-order it now if I could!
But while I've heard rumours and wishes, I haven't seen solid evidence that it is imminent, and it isn't on the lens roadmap.
What do you know about this that I don't know?
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-03-2018, 12:21 AM
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There are two separate aims, depending on the purpose of the archiving:
First, to archive the scene. This would be of use to future historians. This is rather like "photojournalism" or "wildlife" in a competition, where the winning photographer may be required to supply the original raw file so that judges can ensure that the photo is a "true representation". DNG works for this case.
Second, to archive the photographer's interpretation. This is of use to future curators of photography. The archive needs to be as close as possible to the photographer's chosen output medium. TIFF works for some cases, but in other cases prints need to be preserved. ---------- Post added 3rd Nov 2018 at 07:24 AM ----------
I think "Possibly for straight documentary shots" corresponds to part of my response to Steve.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-02-2018, 10:42 AM
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Here is a possibility that I haven't analysed much yet: The Cloud.
I've experimented with the new cloud-based Lightroom CC. (Which is different from the desktop-based Lightroom Classic CC, which is a descendent of the familiar Lightroom 6).
As I added more files on one PC, they ended up on the Adobe Cloud. They were then accessible from my other PC, and from a web browser after login at lightroom.adobe.com. I think they were also accessible from an app on Android or iOS. (I was using DNG, but I assume this would apply to other raw formats, and it certainly works with JPEG).
They were stored on media maintained by Adobe; both the raw files and the editing metadata. (There is some tricky synchronisation involved!) So the storage medium is the responsibility of a big corporation rather than individual users. (That itself raises different questions, of course).
While the photos are on the Adobe Cloud, various added-value operations can be performed on them, such as keywording (and I think facial recognition). I assume both archiving and storage media migration will routinely be performed.
Somewhere in all of that are clues about how future-proofing might happen.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-02-2018, 01:56 AM
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This isn't about me! It is about comparing PEF with DNG.
We need a link to the specification of PEF so that we can see if it has technical advantages over DNG. (Anyone?)
We need a link to the PEF SDK so that we can examine whether PEF is easier to develop for than DNG. (Anyone?)
Are there any cases where where other camera manufacturers felt that it was better to use PEF than DNG? (Several have used DNG).
Why doesn't Ricoh use PEF for Ricoh-branded cameras? (They use DNG).
Why didn't Pentax feel the need to support PEF in the four Q-System cameras? (They used DNG).
We need links to any cases where PEF had been recommended or endorsed as an archival raw file format. (DNG has).
Why did the US Library of Congress endorsed the use of DNG rather than PEF for sustainability of their photography collections? Re: DNG - yes or no?: Nikon FX SLR (DF, D1-D5, D600-D850) Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
Here is a 2005 discussion about this topic: PhotoshopNews: Photoshop News and Information » Archive » Digital Preservation
Here is a 2011 discussion about DNG and Digital Access Management: Digital Asset Management Meets Adobe DNG
As far as I can tell from everything written in this thread, the primary merit that has been identified for PEF compared with DNG is that some people simply prefer using PEF!
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-01-2018, 02:23 PM
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When I stopped counting in 2010, there were 14 cameras makers using DNG, 47 camera models using DNG, 240+ software products able to process DNG to some or a full extent, and 290+ Adobe-Convertible raw image formats. And about 7 or 8 alternative DNG converters to cater for niche or hacked cameras that the Adobe DNG Converter didn't cater for.
DNG has made it easier for niche and minority camera makers to output raw files and get their raw files processed.
Suppose that you were developing a digiscope that can record raw files. You need a raw file format to write. You needed raw file converters to process those raw files. What do you do?
Answer (and it has been done): use DNG. The format is published and freely available. There is an SDK to help develop the DNG code. Once completed, there are perhaps 100 or more software products that can now process your images.
There are many other niche and minority cameras that have benefited in the same way. Life became easier for those camera makers and users.
DNG is unlike any other raw file format.It is the only one with a freely available specification. It is the only one with a freely available (no questions asked and no NDA) SDK comprising C++ and executables. There are various other aids for using it too: Digital Negative (DNG), Adobe DNG Converter | Adobe Photoshop CC
There is a weird attitude that some people have towards DNG. It is fairly common for people to say "DNG has problem X, so I'll continue using my ... [CR2s] ... [NEFs] ... [PEFs] ... ". Yet those raw file formats not only also suffer from problem X, but also lots more problems. Somehow, their anti-DNG (or perhaps anti-Adobe) attitude is so strong that they think a problem X with DNG (even if it exists) is vastly more serious than the same problem X and lots more with their own camera makers' non-DNG raw files.
Another common trap that people fall into is that because the format of DNG is specified they can see things that they think (rightly or wrongly) are problems. But because the format of their own camera makers' non-DNG raw files are not published, they can't see what problems are lurking there, so they appear to assume there aren't any!
Some people have criticised DNG for allowing data of unpublished format to be output as DNGPrivateData in the file. While ignoring the fact that everything in their own camera makers' non-DNG raw files is in unpublished format! It is hard to find faults with DNG that are not present (along with many more) in camera makers non-DNG raw files. DNG is the only archival raw file format Endorsements for DNG
How many other raw file formats are used by cameras of several different manufacturers? And why not? (As far as I know, DNG is the only raw file format for which explicit permission has been published for everyone and all organisations to use it).
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-01-2018, 12:28 PM
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I deleted PEFs until I started to use DNGs in-camera. Then there were no longer any PEFs to be deleted!. That happened perhaps a decade or so ago.
It should be obvious that I am not, and never have been, anxious! I have never had a reason to be anxious, once I established that PEFs were irrelevant and useless to me.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
11-01-2018, 07:31 AM
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Having worked as an engineer in the IT industry, I beleieve there is a hierarchy of technical decision-making in Pentax:
Higher-up, there is a decision about what raw file formats are available for Pentax cameras to use. For a long time this was something like "always use DNG, optionally use PEF". We can deduce that from the raw file formats that new Pentax cameras actually used over many years. What we can't deduce is whether that decision has now changed. The last DNG-only camera I know of was announced in 2014. There have only been 6 Pentax cameras announced since then).
Below that higher-level there is a specific decision made for every camera. Perhaps the higher level policy has now changed to "DNG and PEF", or perhaps it is just an accident of history that we haven't seen any more DNG-only cameras since 2014.
Then at the lowest level there are people setting the defaults in the camera. The defaults are somewhat arbitrary. When I get a new camera I go through the menu setting the camera as I want it. I don't take the defaults seriously, because they tend to be chosen by people who don't do photography the way I do. In both the K-1ii and the K-3ii there doesn't appear to be any preference in the operating manual for one or the other. I can't remember which way they were set by default, and I don't care because they are set to DNG now!
It wasn't camera manufacturers who put pressure on Adobe. It was users. I was a user of DNG from 10 days after it was launched at the end of September 2004. The concern of a number of us was that, while the Adobe software at the time didn't need the Makernote which the DNG Converter had used to generate the DNG Metadata, things may change in future. Perhaps a later DNG Converter could exploit more the Makernote? Perhaps software other than that from Adobe could exploit some of the "secret auce"? (The DNG Converter can read a DNG, of course, so a thought was that if the Makernote was preserved, it could be further exploited by the latest DNG Converter).
I kept my PEFs until I was confident that they had been converted properly, and especially until the Makernote was preserved as DNGPrivateData. I was able to reconvert where relevant. Then I deleted all my PEFs. From that point on, (in 2005, about 6 months or so after I started to use DNG), after checking that a batch of conversions had worked, I had the confidence to delete my PEFs. That never caused me a problem.
Which camera manufacturers would be concerned and have sufficient influence to cause Adobe to provide DNGPrivateData? Obviously not those who had their own raw file formats and their own software to process them. Canon and Nikon hadn't made a decision use DNG in-camera and supply software that could process DNG and exploit any "secret sauce" their cameras might have put there. DNG was at best irrelevant to them, and at worst an irritant to be suppressed.
Leica was the first rumoured camera maker to use DNG in-camera, and one of the first to do so. I believe they packaged Photoshop Elements with their first cameras to use DNG. And Photoshop Elements didn't exploit any "secret sauce"in DNGs. Like other Adobe software processing DNGs, it uses the published DNG metadata. So Leica had no reason to put pressure on Adobe.
Ricoh's GR series was the first compact camera to use DNG, and in fact Ricoh exploit DNG more than most. They use DNG 1.3.0.0 in order to use the lens-correction opcodes. (The K-1-series "only" uses DNG 1.2.0.0).
It is worth noting that, when I stopped counting in 2010, there were 14 cameras makers using DNG, 47 camera models using DNG, 240+ software products able to process DNG to some or a full extent, and 290+ Adobe-Convertible raw image formats. And about 7 or 8 alternative DNG converters to cater for niche or hacked cameras that the Adobe DNG Converter didn't cater for.
For comparison, during the first 5 years when about 38 camera models were launched that wrote DNG, Adobe software added support for about 21 Canon models, about 20 Nikon models, and about 22 Olympus models.
That says more about those raw converters than about DNG! DNG is comprehensive. It caters for more capability than a typical camera uses. After all, Adobe software manages with just the published DNG specification features of DNG, so it can be done.
I take the converse view. PEF is irrelevant to me, so the fact that my Q-Series cameras didn't use PEF wasn't an issue to me. All I ask from a Pentax camera is "please use DNG; it doesn't matter whether you support PEF".
Why?
I can take a K-1ii DNG which I've used in Lightroom, put it onto an SD Card, put it back into the K-1ii, and view it. In fact, a minute before I wrote this I did precisely this! It has not been changed by Lightroom. (I've also just used the DNG SDK to examine the DNG file and verify this).
I suspect you are talking about using Lightroom to store the catalogued metadata editting back into the DNG. Rather than say, storing it as an XMP file, or simply using the Lightroom catalogue and not interfere with the DNG. I don't do that.
I don't let my DNGs get changed by Lightroom. But PEFs can also be changed by software! To the best of my knowledge, there is no way of detecting whether a PEF has been changed since it left the camera. ---------- Post added 1st Nov 2018 at 02:41 PM ----------
Interesting!
See my experience at the address below: Support via DNG but not native raws
I one found that Phase One Capture One wouldn't support DNGs derived in any way from rival digital backs. So I used a hex-editor to change the camera/back name in the DNG to a same-size meaningless string of letters, and the software then worked!
It deliberately checked for, and rejected, DNGs that had the names of rivals in them! ---------- Post added 1st Nov 2018 at 02:47 PM ----------
When I stopped counting in 2010, there were 14 cameras makers using DNG, 47 camera models using DNG, 240+ software products able to process DNG to some or a full extent, and 290+ Adobe-Convertible raw image formats. And about 7 or 8 alternative DNG converters to cater for niche or hacked cameras that the Adobe DNG Converter didn't cater for. Products that support DNG in some way |
Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
10-30-2018, 08:50 AM
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My aim isn't to change what you do. I'm trying to establish some facts that will stand up to scrutiny.
I believe the following is true:
From when Pentax began to use DNG in cameras, they have continued to support DNG in all subsequent cameras that support raw
But the converse does not apply. There have been a number of Pentax cameras that support DNG but not PEF.
Not the major K-Mount cameras, but some nevertheless: Q-Series; K-500 (?); K-30 (?); MX-1 (?). Perhaps others.
Edit: Whoops! I've just that "Not a Number" was there before me! https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/6-pentax-dslr-discussion/378298-raw-file...ml#post4501388
My interpretation is that DNG is now the Pentax main and consistent raw file format, and PEF is an optional extra for historical purposes.
(Ricoh uses DNG, not its own raw file format if they ever had one, for its own cameras that support raw. Such as the GR II, and I'm confident for the GR III next year).
When Adobe software handles a DNG from out of a camera, it uses the published DNG metadata in the file, but not any "secret sauce" that is not in the DNG specification.
(What actually happened is that Adobe identified what it needed to do its raw conversions, and designed the DNG metadata to match!)
I believe the DNG format has never been influenced by the needs of a Pentax camera. Those cameras have used DNG "as-is".
(I believe this leaves something to be desired when Pixel-Shift is used. But that appears to apply whether Adobe is processing a PEF or a DNG).
I accept that there is probably some non-Adobe software that supports PEFs (once they have reversed engineered them) but not DNG.
At one time this was typically because they had already done much of the work to support PEFs, and avoided the extra generic work to support DNGs for any cameras.
I'm not sure what reasons they give nowadays.
Something interesting about DNG is the amount of material available free with no questions asked and no Non-Disclosure Agreements.
Obviously the DNG specifications!
But also the DNG SDK. It comes with both executable programs and lots of C++ files. I often use it to have a peek inside out-of-camera DNGs, hence the DNGs from my own Pentax cameras and also the Ricoh GR II.
I've been using DNG for over 14 years. I've published a huge amount about it: DNG - Digital Negative format DNG » Barry's blog
In the unlikely event you feel the need to read it, I would welcome being informed of any errors you find. ---------- Post added 30th Oct 2018 at 04:05 PM ----------
Adobe offered DNG to ISO years ago. ISO TC42 WG18 were expected to publish it as an ISO standard. It would then not belong to Adobe in any sense.
For some reason, (my contacts won't say why), this process appears to have stalled.
Adobe did the same with TIFF, (which they "own"). Unfortunately ISO mangled it to become TIFF/EP, which was not prescriptive enough to be useful for interchange. It ended up more as a kit of optional parts.
(DNG and NEF are both based on TIFF/EP. DNG was Adobe's proposal to ISO to make TIFF/EP a more useful standard).
(Adobe also supplied PDF to ISO. It is now, I think, 3 ISO standards, and Adobe don't own it. I think ISO have also taken over XMP, as they presumably needed to for PDF purposes). ---------- Post added 30th Oct 2018 at 04:16 PM ----------
I've haven't time to check, but here is my guess:
The DNG Converter puts XMP into the DNG to record what it has done.
Probably the camera simply can't handle the XMP. After all, it is not needed by the camera and doesn't put it in the DNG.
If that is the reason, I don't know why the camera can't ignore it.
There are other possibilities.
Perhaps Pentax cameras write using a subset of DNG, for example with the image data stored in a particular way. But the DNG Converter (legitimately according to the specification) happens to use a different structure.
In other words, there is no need for a camera to implement the full generality of DNG, because it never expects to encounter it.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
10-29-2018, 07:52 AM
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It is important to distinguish between the generic raw file format such as "PEF", and the specific raw file format such as "PEF from K-1".
The former doesn't pose much of a problem. It is the latter that can cause problems, as your example "support for new camera raw formats within months of their release, open-source software within weeks or even days" indicates.
There will be "PEFs from K-1s" around. Will they be sufficient to decide how to perform high quality raw conversions in the new software, without being able to test by experimenting with a camera?
It may be worth noting the vast number of ways that cameras differ from one-another: DNG and camera innovation
Perhaps it will be possible by using (say) dcraw. After all, Dave Coffin decided to re-design dcraw to conform to some aspects of DNG. So now some features of DNG, including some DNG metadata values for a large range of cameras, are openly available. So in future software will be able to benefit from DNG metadata when processing non-DNG raw files for cameras supported by dcraw. Perhaps in future many people will use PEF in-camera and (perhaps unknowingly) end up with a raw conversion that relies on DNG metadata values.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
10-29-2018, 06:42 AM
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A PEF doesn't fully describe the image. That is why software that supports PEFs from existing cameras has to be updated to support PEFs from new cameras. The software developer has to learn about the extra details that the PEF doesn't hold, and build that into the software.
How are future software developers going to discover what those necessary extra details are that are needed for raw conversions? They may not be able to play around with existing cameras to reverse-engineer those details.
A DNG holds those details in extra metadata that enables software to perform a high-quality raw conversion on a new camera without having to build in extra details for that camera. A huge amount and variety of such details is catered for by DNG. That is why there have so far been just 5 versions of DNG in over 14 years. (1.0.0.0 to 1.4.0.0). And even the K-1-series only needs and outputs 1.2.0.0!
(The current Ricoh GR series uses version 1.3.0.0 because it uses lens-correction opcodes which were introduced in that version).
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
10-29-2018, 05:53 AM
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At one time, Pentax cameras didn't use the DNG compression option.
I can't remember which was the first Pentax camera to use the DNG compression option.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
10-07-2018, 04:16 AM
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As a result of this thread, I'm considering having my K-3 (superseded by my K-3ii) converted for Full Spectrum. Being superseded, I will not want to use it for visible-light photography.
I have a Hoya Infrared R72 which would appear to be useful on such a camera for IR photography.
But what filters would be useful for UV photography? The B+W 77mm UV Black (403) Filter has been discontinued.
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Forum: Digital Processing, Software, and Printing
10-06-2018, 03:20 AM
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Yes.
It can be synchronised into Lightroom Classic CC, or its desktop-oriented predecessors such as Lightroom 6.
And it is a fundamental feature of Lightroom CC, the newer cloud-based variant of Lightroom.
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Forum: Digital Processing, Software, and Printing
10-06-2018, 12:31 AM
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That is what I use - a lot!
I like it because it doesn't simply provide the numbers. It displays a grid of the photos concerned.
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Forum: Digital Processing, Software, and Printing
10-05-2018, 03:14 AM
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It will recognise PEFs for cameras released until Adobe stopped updating Lightroom 6.
PEFs have an overall consistent specification, but have detailed differences from one camera to another.
The specification for DNG rarely changes, because of its large amount of metadata which can cater for a huge range of detailed differences. Lightroom 6 recognises DNGs from all current Pentax cameras, and in fact recognises even later versions of DNG that haven't been used by Pentax cameras yet. (With the qualification that it hasn't caught up with pixel-shift technology yet).
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Forum: Pentax SLR Lens Discussion
09-28-2018, 05:06 AM
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You say you have noted the 28-105mm kit lens. What were you conclusions?
It isn't limited in image quality to what used to be called a "kit lens". It is very good indeed across the frame and at all settings. Often it is the only lens I use all day on my K-1-series, and I read of others who think the same.
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Forum: Pentax DSLR Discussion
09-26-2018, 08:02 AM
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Hm! I use my K-3ii as my back-up for my K-1ii.
You appear to have ruled that out.
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Forum: Troubleshooting and Beginner Help
09-13-2018, 11:22 PM
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Others have answer your basic question. I'll add something that I haven't spotted here.
The K-1-series also has "Square" crop mode. About 24 MP. All it really gives you is a visual indication in the viewfinder, which some people may find useful, while others don't.
I discussed it at the DPReview thread below. (Including how to recover images back to 36 MP in Lightroom). Revisiting SQUARE crop on K-1-series |
Forum: Photographic Industry and Professionals
09-06-2018, 12:27 AM
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I haven't gone away!
I have all the recent Pentax FF lenses, and with the right Pentax mirrorless camera, plus the K-mount adapter that Pentax would supply (unless they had a death-wish), I would buy such a camera.
(It would co-exist with my K-1ii, hopefully complementing it rather than competing with it or replacing it).
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